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Sub Contractor Hours.

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by PrecisionS&I, Mar 16, 2014.

  1. PrecisionS&I

    PrecisionS&I Member
    from Ohio
    Messages: 75

    This is a question for the guys who use subs. I used a few subs this winter a couple pickups and a couple sidewalk crews. I was looking over log sheets and noticed that one of the pickups took almost 2 hours to do a site that should take no more thank and hour and my sidewalk crew had down an hour at a site that I myself can plow and jump out and do the walks in less than an hour. So my question is do you dock them time and money or just pay them for that period and find someone else?
  2. dieselss

    dieselss PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,391

    Can you prove that it didn't take them an hour?
  3. leolkfrm

    leolkfrm PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,978

    you pay them and next time go there and work with them....maybe they need a process change... maybe it was one of those 20 below wind chill days,
  4. Midwest BuildIt Inc

    Midwest BuildIt Inc PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,280

    can you prove it didnt take that long. i do a couple lots that take about 30 min, all it takes are 1 or 2 cars in the right spot to turn it into a 45-55min lot. Same with walks, heavier takes longer. At one place if its light and the wind is blowing, takes me twice as long to do the walks. The wind blows it around all over the place.
  5. derekbroerse

    derekbroerse 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,377

    Buy a dash camera and have them recording while they work. Time and date stamped....

    I looked thru a sub's hours once, he came to work, did a ten minute driveway, then took almost 3/4 hr to drive to a gas station, fill up, and return. Told him I wasn't paying that, he's supposed to come to work ready to work, not prepare on my dime... not to mention he drove past that same gas station to get to the first driveway he did...
  6. derekbroerse

    derekbroerse 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,377

    Agree with this. Many times property owners are completely oblivious to this, and park numerous company vehicles in tight places with like two spaces in between them and wonder why they don't all get done...
  7. 1olddogtwo

    1olddogtwo PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 12,174

    Ah......what did he tell you when you asked?
  8. mulcahy mowing

    mulcahy mowing Senior Member
    Messages: 718

    It sounds like you might be micro managing your manpower to much.. Twice as long once can be explained by uncontrollable factors, ie visibility, vehicle traffic, vehicle issues, icing Ect. Unless it is a reoccurring problem sometimes it's a give and take. Random spot checks throughout the storm keeps everyone honest. Sometimes you have to work on your business and not in it.
  9. Longae29

    Longae29 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,953

    We almost always plow a site with our own trucks at least for the first year to get a time frame established how long it should take. Let the sub know then how much time they are expected to get it done and better have a darn good reason why it took double.
  10. leigh

    leigh 2000 Club Member
    from CT
    Messages: 2,342

    My subs are all relatives. I tell them what my "record" is for plowing lots.Gives them an idea what I expect.I'm always calling and telling them I've already plowed x amount and where the heck are you, to light a fire under there butts.It's all in good fun,sort of,but they know whats expected. The sidewalk crew is a whole different story,still can't figure out what those guys are doing.4 or more guys and I'm still getting out and doing sidewalks.New guys I have plow with me or an experienced other truck/driver.
  11. Midwest BuildIt Inc

    Midwest BuildIt Inc PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,280

    also i have a restaurant that i do. even with every parking space full, it takes ten min to do the drives one time and 35 min the next time. all depends how many people are coming and going, take out pick ups, people driving through looking for a spot to park.

    now if we are talking 3am and empty parking lot, and they are taking too long, different story. Have a talk with them, if he bs's you get rid of him. If he has a reason, even if you dont agree, correct the problem and give another chance.

    Maybe his truck was running hot so he went slow, not really your problem i know. He could have bailed on you, but chose to stay and get it done. kind of a draw on that one.

    Do you pay travel time? I get paid from the time i get to the first lot until everything is finished. I write down the times for each lot, but not exact times. I basically write down when i leave each lot. So my time for lot 2 would be the time from i left lot 1, till i left lot 2. If i get stuck in traffic, it might look like i spent a lot of time there. Really i spent a lot of time stuck in traffic.
  12. Sawboy

    Sawboy PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,700

    The question next year will be "How do I get subs to plow, without rushing and leaving the lot looking poor". Hire good guys, pay them well, don't micro manage them. I'm a sub, and I'm treated like a business partner. Good workers ALWAYS find good bosses, and vice versa. It's not coincidental.

    CARDOCTOR PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,312

    pay a flat per push or inch rate.
  14. Whiffyspark

    Whiffyspark 2000 Club Member
    from SOMD
    Messages: 2,403

    That's fine when they have one lot. Several it's not
  15. White Gardens

    White Gardens 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,665


    Takes all the guess work out of it.

  16. GMCHD plower

    GMCHD plower PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,831

    Same here, I sub for a friend, and feel treated like a partner. I plow what I'm told, and plow it as well as possible, even though their technically not MY accounts, it is still my reputation to him, which translates to his reputation to his customers. He makes more money and is happy, I make more money and am happy.

    CARDOCTOR PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,312

    i do 5 place's and get paid a flat fee per. no travel time . plus extra to salt

    i also have a few that pays by the inch no travel time.
  18. 1olddogtwo

    1olddogtwo PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 12,174

    How does that work with you do opening plows?

    Say a 8-12 snow is falling and its 9AM. Working 5 lots just plowing entrys on fronts of stores to keep them open. Let's say the day ends at 6 pm. Store close at 9pm. how does that work?
  19. Whiffyspark

    Whiffyspark 2000 Club Member
    from SOMD
    Messages: 2,403

    I get paid for everything from the time I'm on call to end of clean up.

    They'll pay us to sleep in a hotel if it's going to be bad. Paid hour breaks etc

    All hourly. 70-80 an hour depending on total fall
  20. OldSchoolPSD

    OldSchoolPSD Senior Member
    Messages: 242

    Paying by the hour is inviting this kind of thing. Pay them on a percentage or gross or a fixed rate.