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Salting Alternative

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by JohnnyRoyale, Feb 22, 2008.

  1. JohnnyRoyale

    JohnnyRoyale 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,935

    I had a brainstorm one night while plowing to heat a brine solution of some sort and spray it on the snow and ice-does a system like this exist? I imagined it would have the same effect of what happens when we jump out of the truck in the middle of the night and take a squirt on the snow. If this works, we won't be at the mercy of the salt capitalists. Think about it.
  2. Grn Mtn

    Grn Mtn PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,644

    well, a brine is a liquefied salt solution so the salt manufactures will still be happy, and your pee is already a deicing product called urea so that is why that works. Heating a liquid up is not necessary because the chemicals that react with snow basically do that already.

    MagCl and CaCl alone or mixed with NaCl along with agricultural or distillery by-products make very effective additions and/or alternatives.
  3. JohnnyRoyale

    JohnnyRoyale 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,935

    I undertand the chemistry of 'brine' and its current uses. Im suggesting the chemical process gets expedited by heating the solution, -(cold brine over snow vs hot brine over snow) possibly to the point we could melt a 2 inch (or more) accumulation. The salt guys would still profit, but quantities required would be consdierably less than traditional salting methods.
  4. SnowMatt13

    SnowMatt13 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,559

    If you want to see what's new...look to Europe.
    They are years, yes years, ahead in snow and ice technology.
    There have been a lot of larger agencies in our area going to Europe to see what they have going on.
    As far as the heat subject I know they had come up with using the vehicles exhaust to heat dry material before it is spread, so heating liquid may have already been experimented with, you might with a search, be able to find out some info. from over there....
  5. Grn Mtn

    Grn Mtn PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,644

    ahh, well i'm thinking the sustainable heat energy in any liquid sprayed wouldn't last long enough to melt significantly more material and would require more energy(cost) to heat than that which would make it worth it.

    now heating the pellets of salt on the otherhand actually might work, hmmmmm.
  6. creativedesigns

    creativedesigns PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,929

    cool thought! You should conduct a home based test to verify an answer! I'm not sure if heating rock salt would break down the physical traits it carries when cold? I wonder if it were to be heated, if the salt would still react & break appart icey elements. Or mabe it would have double the melting power compared to cold salt? Hmmmm:cool:
  7. magnatrac

    magnatrac PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,059

    In the summer I use our left over calcium chloride( pela dow, dow flake) on the drive way to keep the dust down. We have used a few different methods to put it down. We've tried just putting it down dry and also mixing it with water. When we mixed it with water I quickly understood how it melts ice so good! If you place 5 or 10 pounds in a 5 gal. bucket of water and wait a minute or 2 the bucket will get so hot you cannot touch it. I knew it reacted with the snow to cause it to melt but I had no idea how much of a reaction it was. Anyway this is my experiance with mixing a prouduct with water. I don't know if it would help at all in the winter ,but it sure works great all summer to keep the dust down !!!
    Good Luck !!!!
  8. JohnnyRoyale

    JohnnyRoyale 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,935

    I'll test it out on the next snowfall-and post my pics and results.
  9. BigLou80

    BigLou80 Senior Member
    Messages: 558

    I cant see how its going to be cheaper to heat it up enough to make a difference. Fuel is way more expensive then salt.

  10. michigancutter

    michigancutter Senior Member
    Messages: 539

    What if we could infuse the idea of a hair dryer but in a bigger magnatude? It does not take much to melt snow, Black top heats up pretty quick, so if we could incorparate some kind of electic heated device to the front of our trucks we could heat the cement or black top to a degree of 35 to 40 and melt the ice and not have to worry about refreezing because the hot air would also dry the ground for minimal reicing. just a thought. just sick of relying on gas & salt companies to run my biz.
  11. sk187

    sk187 Senior Member
    Messages: 338

    Tomorrow we are attempting a 4,000 gallon brine solution on a 2.5 million acre property in West Michigan.
  12. WMHLC

    WMHLC Senior Member
    Messages: 248

    Going to need alot more brine than that. That's got to be like half the state. :dizzy: I think you meant to say 2.5 million square feet.

  13. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 13,253

    What's there to attempt? It's been done before. Heck, Ottawa County was applying brine 20 years ago. It's getting used right now all over. I have a 325 and 1250 gallon sprayer for applying brine or whatever liquid you might want to try.
  14. sk187

    sk187 Senior Member
    Messages: 338

    There you are Mark.

    Anyway, yes 2.5sq ft.

    I have a 2 2000 gallon trucks for spraying, same thing we use for summer dust control.
  15. Superior L & L

    Superior L & L PlowSite Veteran
    from MI
    Messages: 3,041

    I believe when he said attempt he means he will attempt it for the first time for him