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Premium Diesel or #2?

Discussion in 'Ford Trucks' started by EZSnow, Sep 6, 2003.

  1. EZSnow

    EZSnow Senior Member
    Messages: 205

    The station I buy my fuel from is a good, high-volume station with the best price around. I have always filled at the same pump, which is marked "Premium Diesel" but recently, my wife fueled the truck and called me worried that she had used the wrong fuel... :eek: Turns out she used the other side of the same island, but it's marked "#2 with OTR" Truck seemed to run fine, and I got my typical 15.5mpg, so I guess I'm not worried for now. I am concerned about which to run come winter, though.
    I also noticed that both fuel types are also available at the high-flow (big rig) pumps as well. I have about 6,000 miles of diesel experience, so any insight will be much appreciated.
  2. seville009

    seville009 Senior Member
    from CNY
    Messages: 877

    If she got it out of the same pump, it should be the same no matter which side you filled up on. I use diesel in a tractor and all of the times that I've filled up my 5 gallon can, I've always seen the #2 designation. It may be that the "premium" sticker is just advertising for the brand that they only stuck on one side of the pump.

    I'm no expert, buy my understanding is that generally there is only #1 or #2, with #2 blen being for low temperature (ie: winter) use.
  3. Pelican

    Pelican 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,075

    Diesel and #2 are virtually the same, the diesel has a few more additives to keep the engine a bit cleaner and the highway taxes are in the price.

    Used to be everyone ran #2 and taxes were paid on an honor system according to the miles driven, but I think too many were cheating and probably the bookkeeping got too expensive on the governments end, so now all on road vehicles must run clear diesel fuel. #2 has a dye added so it can be detected by inspectors, then a hefty fine (up to $10,000) can be applied if a violation is discovered.

    I've run my diesel powered machines on #2 since I've owned them with no problems, except in extreme cold it can gel up and clog the fuel filters if not treated.

    I'm not sure if the OTR you mention might mean "Over The Road" where the highway taxes would have been added making it suitable for highway use. There would be a sign by the pump warning of the misuse of the fuel and associated fines.
  4. easthavenplower

    easthavenplower Senior Member
    Messages: 282

    if it gets that cold and the diesil gels up add a little karosine it will prevent the gelling but please somebody correct me if im wrong before somebody blows up their engine
  5. EZSnow

    EZSnow Senior Member
    Messages: 205

    Pelican, it's a fairly modern station with pay-at-the-pump, and they run as many as 4 types of gas through one hose, so a a different type of diesel on either side would not surprise me. They are both 'taxed' fuels- dyed green (I believe red is non-tax) and sold for the same price. ($1.46 by the way)

    I asked the girl at the desk what the difference was, and as clueless as she seemed to be, she said that there is no difference 'this time of year'. I wonder which is going to get blended? The "#2 OTR" sign was also a replaceable one in a plastic sheath like a dessert menu. Maybe they put a different sign in it when it's blended. Also, I can't imagine that in MN, where old lady winter will regularly give us sub-zeros for a week at a time (snow or not) they would sell anything BUT winter blend.

    I thought #1 was kerosene or heating oil and it gets mixed with #2 to make winter blend.

  6. cat320

    cat320 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,224

    I run my backhoe on #2 fuel/heating oil and put the additive in it been running fine.Just like was said above they are the same except for the blending for winter fuel.Kerosean can be added to thin the mix out I think and 80/20 .
  7. wyldman

    wyldman Member
    Messages: 3,265

    There is a difference between "Premium" diesel and the regular #2 OTR.It has more cetane,more additives,and usually comes at a premium price.
  8. micah79

    micah79 Senior Member
    Messages: 303

    I use the #2 in my Dodge, and I add Howes Diesel Treat. I think I'm better off doing iot this way, and I save some $$$
  9. EZSnow

    EZSnow Senior Member
    Messages: 205

    there's no price difference between these fuels
  10. micah79

    micah79 Senior Member
    Messages: 303

    There sure is! At least where I get mine.
  11. EZSnow

    EZSnow Senior Member
    Messages: 205

    I don't doubt there might be, but at this station, nobody knows the difference, and the price is the same on both pumps... $1.46 Truck runs fine on either... I guess I'll try to find out who the supplier is and ask them.
  12. micah79

    micah79 Senior Member
    Messages: 303

    Cool deal. A lot of stations sell a winterized formula too. I like to add my own additive though because it provides antigel, boosts the cetane level and provides sulfer substitutes. It also gets rid of most of the smoke. I can still make her smoke if I get on it, but it helps a lot. Howes diesel treat is good stuff. Diesel fuel nowdays is low in sulfer for environmental reasons
  13. Pelican

    Pelican 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,075

    I misunderstood, some places around here have two pumps, one for highway vehicles and one for off road machines. The latter has no highway tax and is quite a bit cheaper. I'd be surprised if both pumps aren't drawing from the same tank in your case.

    Diesel is 189.9 here!:realmad:
  14. Mike 97 SS

    Mike 97 SS Banned
    from U.S.A.
    Messages: 1,106

    I may be wrong on this, but I think OTR means Off The Road, meaning its more like heating oil and only to be used in construction machines that are used on job sites. You cant or arent supposed to fill up regular diesel trucks with it and drive on public roads or highways. I dont know where I got this, but for some reason I just remember someone telling me this. I know there are some diesel fuels that have a red look to them, and I think thats the one Im referring to. Its like your being sold heating oil. When you see a real cheap diesel fuel price, its most likely not the good stuff. By the way, diesel fuel at my dads shop is 1.699 a gallon as of right now. We keep the price up a bit because we have a great location right off the highway and we are 1 of only 2 places in the town that actually sell diesel. Mike :drinkup:
  15. micah79

    micah79 Senior Member
    Messages: 303

    I think its the same stuff, the only difference is that the off road has the red dye, and you dont pay the taxes on the off road. I'm pretty sure its the same fuel though. It just dyed for dot inspections.
  16. Rooster

    Rooster Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 650

    Typically at a truck stop when I drove over the road as an owner operator.

    Off road fuel is dyed. Preimum and #1 Diesel were for winter use.

    #2 Diesel was for warmer weather.

    Although that was many years ago.

  17. EZSnow

    EZSnow Senior Member
    Messages: 205


    As I was fueling today, I went into the store to see what today's village idiot behind the counter knew about diesel fuel. Turns out the GM of the station was there...
    First, both sides of the island pump the same fuel, the premium a marketing designation.

    #2 is straight summer diesel
    #1 is what they mix to winterize summer diesel for anti-gelling

    OTR is a lubricity additive that compensates for the reduction in lubricity caused by the processes that remove sulfur. As a side-effect, it provides a "winter factor" of 20%. This makes it the anti-gelling equivalent of a 20% #1 mix. As it gets colder, this is then mixed with #1 to further enhance the anti-gel properties of the fuel. This station is only a few miles from the refinery and goes through 2-3 transports of diesel each day, so they are constantly adjusting their mix with weather forecasts and conditions. He claims to not have had a gel in the five years this station has been operating.

    SO, I guess I'm getting 'Premium' #2 with OTR!!

    It seems that the constantly changing formula is a really good reason to stick with a high-volume station.

    I got edumacated in diesel today and thought I'd pass it on!

  18. micah79

    micah79 Senior Member
    Messages: 303

    Thanks, Derek, its always a big mystery, because like you said, no one ever knows anything at the counter of a gas station. I think I'll still put the addative in mine, cause it sure helps with the smoke, and I think its helping my milage by about 3 miles/gallon. Now I'll have to see what the locals are putting in the tanks around here. (I'm kinda scared to find out) lol
  19. seville009

    seville009 Senior Member
    from CNY
    Messages: 877

    From http://dodgeram.org/tech/dsl/FAQ/diesel_fuel.htm#FAQ

    > 4. Related to question 3, I do recall seeing something like "Highway
    > Diesel #2" posted on the pumps at the station. What exactly does this
    > mean with respect to sulfur and cetane rating?

    It means that the sulfur level is approved for highway use and catalytic converters. Diesel #2 is heavier than #1. It also (usually) has lower Cetane and more heat energy per gallon than #1. #2 will tend to form wax crystals and gel at temperatures below 10 degrees F. Most winter fuels are a blend of #1 and #2, but when it gets really cold I add fuel conditioner to avoid clogging the fuel filter with wax crystals.
  20. micah79

    micah79 Senior Member
    Messages: 303

    Diesel engines like sulfer though. Its just the epa that made them take it out of the #2. I'll admit that it is bad for the environment, but the sulfer provides lubrication, and is good for the engine.