1. Welcome to PlowSite. Notice a fresh look and new features? It’s now easier to share photos and videos, find popular topics fast, and enjoy expanded user profiles. If you have any questions, click HELP at the top or bottom of any page, or send an email to help@plowsite.com. We welcome your feedback.

    Dismiss Notice

Moron designers at GM

Discussion in 'Chevy Trucks' started by Barkleymut, Apr 2, 2003.

  1. Barkleymut

    Barkleymut PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 29

    I've been keeping up with this forum pretty well for the past several months so I hope this isn't a repeat comment. I changed the oil myself for the first time today on my 03 2500HD w/6Liter. I thought the drain plug looked awfully close to the exhaust pipe. Well I went ahead and bam. The oil went everywhere. I know not many people change their own oil anymore, but come on. Also what is up with the tube you pour the oil into? I looks like a 5 cent piece of plastic. Also why is the oil filter so small? Seems like my 98 Dodge w/a 318 had a filter that was twice this size.

    And most important. How much oil should I put in there??? I got a free oil change at the dealer for the first one and they put in 6.5 quarts. The owners manual says 6 quarts. Maybe I'll just call the dealership tomorrow. The oil filter sure is hard to get a good grip on. There is no room between the filter and the oil pan for almost half of the gripping area.

    Enough gripeing though. I really love the truck. It pulls a 24 ft trailer weighing about 7,000 lbs. with no problems. When unhitched it drives like a dream.
  2. wxmn6

    wxmn6 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,037

    For a moment, I thought that this is another thread about the Chevy '03 front end design. :D

    I don't change oil myself, but I have heard some 6.0L gas owners that do change oil on thier trucks that has to deal with what you just described. They said that the oil would hit part of exhause manifold so they have to use plastic tube to divert the oil away from them. So it is not just the 2003 that is having this kind of deal.
  3. SnowMatt13

    SnowMatt13 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,559

    My 2001 2500HD 6.0L takes 6.5 quarts of oil. Yes my owner's manual says 6 and I believed them. Until a month after I changed my oil and found it to be a half a quart low. I was a little upset at first because I thought the engine had consumed a half a quart. Next oil change I put in 6 1/2 and it's right on the money. Maybe the engineers should talk to the people who write the owners manual.:confused: :eek:
  4. Pelican

    Pelican 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,075

    My comments aren't along the lines of what you guys are saying, but fit the thread title.

    We bought an '02 Impala LS new 18 months ago after looking at all the current offerings by domestic manufacturers in this class car. I liked the styling and performance of the Impala, but the longer we had it, the more it began to disappoint us.

    I loved the way it drove and handled, and the acceleration was snappy, but the little annoyances began to overwhelm the positives. I couldn't get comfortable in the car. The armrest was too low and the windowsill was too high, there was no place to rest my arm comfortably. What I would end up doing was drop the tilt wheel low and rest my arms in my lap. The accessory switches looked like something that belonged in a 20 year old Jap car, CHEAP! The windows would fog up during rain, the defroster wouldn't clear them, including the rear defogger. The wipers were the noisiest I had ever heard, along with the heater blower.

    The headlights would flicker at night, making me uneasy with the thought that they would go out permanently. The dealer said "They do that".

    The engineers didn't do their homework on this car, and it finally annoyed us to the point that we left it at another dealership the other night. I think it will be a while before another Chevy is in our driveway.
  5. BigRedBarn

    BigRedBarn Senior Member
    Messages: 133

    Think about it... are the designers (engineers) really the morons?

    Or, are the high-ups who over-ride the engineers the morons?

    Engineers are hard working, ethical people for the most part (I'm one). We have to attend college just like doctors and lawyers, yet we don't make anyhwere near their salaries. Why do we become engineers, then? Because we love what we do.

    Do you really think engineers want to cut corners? Do you think engineers really want to rush designs to market without enough testing and analysis? Do you think engineers like having their designs "worked over" by non-engineers just to save money and rush product to market? Do you think engineers sleep well at night knowing that they didn't have the chance to properly develop their designs?

    Just remember the Shuttle Challenger. One engineer was over-ruled on postponing the take-off. Look what happened.

    Please, remember some of these questions the next time you want to tear a new @$$hole into the engineer or designer who worked on your vehicle.

  6. Pelican

    Pelican 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,075

    Nothing personal BigRedBarn, but ergonomics is an engineering issue.
  7. plowking35

    plowking35 2000 Club Member
    from SE CT
    Messages: 2,923

    The capacity of the pan is 6 qts, then add 1/2 qt for the filter.
  8. BigRedBarn

    BigRedBarn Senior Member
    Messages: 133


    Good point on the ergonomics. But, stylists (artsy-fartsy types)might be to blame there.

    Also, someone who drives a truck often probably won't like the ergonomics in a car. They're just different beasts. I know my brother (drives pickups) hated to drive my old '98 Malibu. But, I know many people (me included) who love the car (I sold mine last Summer).

    I agree that GM's need work on interiors. Car magazines keep stating that too. But, considering the cost of a GM car versus an import, you get what you pay for. GM cars still seem a good buy to me.

    That's just my 2¢.
  9. Brad M.

    Brad M. Member
    from Texas
    Messages: 33

    Out of curiosity to this thread I have called 4 dealers in my area. I have been told 6 quarts to 7.5 quarts of oil to a change. Manual definately says 6 so who do you believe. Before I changed mine the first time I made a note of the level on the stick. After changing and adding 6 quarts and a filter the level was slightly above the original mark. If the dealers can not get together and agree who do you believe?
  10. AVERYX

    AVERYX Junior Member
    Messages: 19

    changing own oil


    This is so true, I drove my truck to my brothers home in Atlanta, and it was the first trip down south for my truck. Wow.......it handled very well on the hwy...Hard to keep it under 80mph....yikes.
    Well I decided I'd change my oil, and I'm looking beneath, and your right the damn oil hit all over the pipe. I didn't even wait long enough for it to cool the pipe was hot.. Do the people at the oil change place experience the same problem.

    Also the guy who spoke about the small filter... I thought the previous oil change place put on the small filter, because the one I purchased (from walmart) was indeed a little longer....

    Just sharing my thoughts............
  11. Little Jay

    Little Jay Senior Member
    Messages: 101

    Oh boy I hope I dont get into trouble here, but I feel the need to add my 2 cents...
    If you dont like getting a little dirt under your finger nails, let the instand oil guys do your work!
    So the oil spills onto the exhaust crossover piece and you have to adjust your catch pan, big deal.
    The filter is too small ?! youve got to be kidding.
    And you actually have to start up your truck, let it warm up for a sec, check for leaks and check the level of oil and adjust it if needed,like you should do in the first place ? Add 1/2 a quart and next time let someone else do it !!!


    CARDOCTOR PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,312

    most engineers are clueless most of the time

    probaly coudnt change a flat

    just because their smart and have a degree doesnt mean they have common sense

    i think they should work at a dealership for a few months so they can be enlighten

    look at the trail blazer 17hrs to do a head gasket

    front shaft goes thu the oil pan what j.a. came up with that idea


    :gunsfiring: :gunsfiring: :gunsfiring:
  13. BWhite

    BWhite Senior Member
    Messages: 496


    Just like everybody else there are a lot of good ones ,mediocre ones and poor ones
  14. tovoninc

    tovoninc Senior Member
    Messages: 105

    Take a look under the hood and compare it to a vehicle from 20 years ago. Big difference. The marketing department dictates the exterior size and styling leaving the design engineer to fit in all the polution, safety and mechanical necessities. Design engineers don't try to make it hard to work on cars but everything has to be fit under the hood.

    The compressed timelines for vehicle development don't leave much time for modifications if a better solution is even possible.

    Yes, I have a design engineering backround. My business ownership related to part time property maintenance is a nice diversion for me.

    This is not much different than the complaint during a snow storm when mr property owner doesn't see the whole picture of what a snow plow operator deals with. Think about it. We are all professionals with different perspectives.
  15. festerw

    festerw Senior Member
    Messages: 986

    If you have problems with the oil hitting the exhaust get one of those Fram SureDrain deals I have one and it makes changing the oil real easy, pull of the dust cover, screw on the hose, let the oil drain, replace dust cover. Takes all of about 30 seconds and no mess.
  16. Bill c

    Bill c PlowSite.com Veteran
    from ny
    Messages: 85

    When I change mine a can of carb cleaner is in my tool tray.A few squirts and the pipe is clean.A longer filter would be nice though.
  17. flatbed

    flatbed Member
    Messages: 36

    how much does the gov. have to do with it .... EPA.. n.h.t.s.a. Ralf Nader....the old t birds with the 429,s you had to loosen the motor mounts or cut holes in the fender wells to get the spark plugs out.....the wife,s 80 TA is the same...just try to get to that last plug....i wont own anything built after 1980.....if i put $30,000 in my k/5.. it would be sweet and i can still work on it.......sorry.....j m 2 cents

    CARDOCTOR PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,312

    i have a few old timers that always say"they dont make them like they use to"my answer to that is no they make them better

    to days cars are alot more reliable and alot less maint than the older cars