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Little Advice.. Productivity of a snow pusher...

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by Plowman52, Oct 23, 2013.

  1. Plowman52

    Plowman52 Senior Member
    from Flint
    Messages: 146

    Hello my friends i have a question i know can get answered on here.

    I recently picked up a 25 acre lot to plow it is wide open besides some light poles.

    I am having a hard decision what to put on the lot... i bid is for a backhoe with a 14 foot push box and two plow trucks and a sidewalk crew.

    My biggest thing i would like help with is there a formula to how many acres a snow pusher will do a hour? and on a 25 acre lot what would you put there and how long do you think it will take you. (lot is smooth, some light poles BUT 70% wide open & pushes are 100-500 feet)

    I have the chance to buy a nice mid size wheel loader that will hold a 12 foot push box. i would like to buy it but I'm not a 100% sure what the productivity rate is on 12 foot and 14 foot push box.

    Just want to be productive thanks for everything guys.
  2. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 13,236

    Wide open lot other than light poles and 25 acres calls for a lot more than a 12 or 14' pusher. Plus 2 trucks. Unless you have all day to plow it.

    I wouldn't touch it with anything less than 2 loaders and at least 16' pushers.
  3. Cover Guy

    Cover Guy Senior Member
    Messages: 224

    I would say with a 14' pusher and 2 trucks it's going to take 6-7 hrs with a 1"-3" snow
  4. Buswell Forest

    Buswell Forest PlowSite.com Addict
    from NH
    Messages: 1,668

    My advice, and I know it costs money, but I'd be looking for 2 older JD 644b loaders, and fabbing or buying 20' pushers. Or the biggest dang pusher I could find / make.
    Then add the 2 trucks for tighter spots and spillage clean-up.....and maybe a quad with a mini-sander for the sidewalks..

    25 acres is a whole lot of area...you will want the 644 loader (or even bigger) when it's time to make space for new snow. Maybe THIS machine with your backhoe..this one will move mass quantity. A 20' pusher is nothing for this one.

    TJSNOW Senior Member
    Messages: 374

    The first snow outta be a party with the equipment you listed.....The first Heavy Wet Snow is just gonna be a thrill a minute....How do you bid a lot that size without knowing production rates of equipment...:confused:
  6. BC Handyman

    BC Handyman PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,943

    not getting into what & why your using listed equipment, I would guess 2-3 aces an hour with a 12-14' pusher, plus an acre an hr for each truck, so 25 acres with listed equip....my guess 5-6hrs on a snow under 4"
  7. Protech Inc.

    Protech Inc. Senior Member
    Messages: 214

    Pro-Tech has a Sno Pusher productivity study that would be helpful in this situation. We would be happy to provide you with a copy. Please e-mail us at marketing@protechcorp.com.
  8. merrimacmill

    merrimacmill PlowSite.com Addict
    from MA
    Messages: 1,823

    Let me preface this entire thing by saying I'm not trying to criticize you by any means. You came here asking for help, and it is what your receiving.

    I'm really failing to understand how or why you bid a lot of that size without having any real solid idea on how you will complete the service for the lot, or using what equipment. There is a huge difference in cost from a backhoe and two trucks, to buying a loader, to having two JD644's as one member here suggested. How did you come up with a price for this? I just don't understand how you can come to an accurate number, not knowing what you will be using.

    I don't think you will even have a hope or prayer of getting that lot done with the listed equipment - while satisfying any customer, even one with the lowest of expectations. What you listed is more suitable for a 5-7 acre lot. For an average service scope of work you should be able to clear the lot corner to corner, curb to curb in 4 hours or less. I adjust my equipment based on production rates and needing to meet that 4 hour or less turn around time.

    Heres the thing, you can get away with light amounts of iron on a lot for many of the storms you will get. But its that one or two big ones that will literally put you out of business so fast you won't even realize what happened. If you don't perform on most lots, you WILL end up in court being sued for negligence and even if you win, the legal costs will be so huge that it will difficult to recover unless you have really deep pockets. A 25 acre lot is very very serious business, and you will realize that the first time you drive up to it with 6" of snow covering it all.

    Another point to consider is what happens if the backhoe or single new loader you buy breaks down. If 25 acres gets away from you during an event, there is no "calling in a buddy" with a truck to help out. It becomes a huge nightmare, very quickly, and you will be responsible to clear it either way. Usually in this situation, the owner calls in a new company and takes that cost from what is owed to you. If it goes above and beyond what you are owed, your still on the hook for the balance.

    Just simply all words of caution to consider before getting your feet wet with a 25 acre lot. Generally people build up enough experience with 5-10 acre lots before going into something like this.

    As for production rates, the ones ProTech offered to provide you are the same ones you will get through SIMA. That is the best information you can get as far as production rates go.

    Personally, for a lot like that, I would have 2-4 loaders and 2-4 trucks/skid steers with plows and or pushers. I give such a range (2-4) because efficiency factors can range from 90% down to 40% or less depending on where snow is being stacked, and how broken up the lot is.
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2013
  9. Camden

    Camden PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 6,604

    Can you put the study on your website?
  10. merrimacmill

    merrimacmill PlowSite.com Addict
    from MA
    Messages: 1,823

    Don't let me speak for Pro-Tech, but I was told by them at one point they had to take it down because it was being taken from the site and used by their competitors for marketing purposes.

    It is literally the same thing SIMA provides though. Even has the same format and text, which leads me to believe Protech provided SIMA with the resource.
  11. Superior L & L

    Superior L & L PlowSite Veteran
    from MI
    Messages: 3,041

    Not that I know much :) by I would say this is dead on. The problem is if that loader goes down you are royally screwed. Have a 2:00am start time and by the time you are finishing up the back 40 people can start showing up at 7:00 and be good to go. Having learned the hard way, (case 721 w/ 20' push box going down on the biggest storm of the year) I would definitely have two loaders out there. Either rent a extra one from crc or get creative on Craig's list.
    Oh and while I'm sure you already know this but if they talk about a big storm, plow with it and never let more than 3/4" build up at a time
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2013