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Just got low balled beyond belief!

Discussion in 'Bidding & Estimating' started by Army Vet, Dec 6, 2011.

  1. Army Vet

    Army Vet Member
    Messages: 47

    So we have been doing snow removal for 11 years and this is a first. Had a bid in to do a apartment complex with 7 buildings. Each building has 2 stories with steps and decks that need cleared along with their respective lots. Then there was a commercial lot with 10 businesses in it. The lot size is 600' x 400' and all the buildings together will take roughly 20 man hours to do. We are using 2 blowers, 2 trucks, 1 kubota rtv w/Boss v, and a JD tractor w/loader and blower to get it done in time. Snow has to be removed with a 2" trigger and salt has to be applied every time.

    We came in at $2300.00 plus salt at $300.00

    The low baller came in at $1200.00 with no limit on snow total and salt usage. That means they will actually not cover their expenses! The kicker is they carry no insurance and are doing it with 1 truck and 4 labors to do it. They already have used this guy in the past and fired him after 2 weeks last season!

    The owner asked if we could do it for that or less. All I could was hold a straight face and not laugh in the owners face. I left it at we will see you in 3 weeks when you need us to save you. But our prices may go up by that time since we will be already busy and would have to rearrange our equipment to be able to do it.

    What is going on in this world? You know this guy can't do it right and have had issues in the past. Really?!?!?!
  2. Army Vet

    Army Vet Member
    Messages: 47

    What would you guys have done?:eek:
  3. buckwheat_la

    buckwheat_la 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,254

    there is no saving stupid from stupid, when they come back to you, double your price if they won't sign a multi year contract
  4. 7_below

    7_below Senior Member
    Messages: 245

    nothing..... the guys an idiot and the people that hired the guy without seeing proof of insurance are idiots too. After the first storm when your heading home for some grub and a nap, just drive by and wave, cause he'll be there til next week. Besides, One slip and fall and the dudes toast!
    Move on.....
  5. RLM

    RLM PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,270

    It happens all the time around here. I just bid on a place about 100 patio homes, the drives come into a cluster of two homes per side then turn 90 degrees to the garage doors (16' each, plus some other frontage that would all have to be back bladed then stuffed, plus main roads couple other areas. I figued about 10 hrs total for plowing, walks was another 10 or so, wanted done by 6am, meaning 2 plows (one skid, one truck) & two shovlers. The guy that has been doing it uses one skid & one guy (to both shovel & plow), I have driven through there at 8:30 am, he isnt even 1/2 way done plowing, then still has all the walks, he just got it for another 3 years (so much for 6am:yow!:). That was durring a normal 3-4" event. I know I wont take on that much responsibility with out being able to have the resources allowed to do it properly. If a major storm or continuous event comes in they are completly screwed. The service manager from the property management companyis well aware of this he called asked me personally to see if we would look at a bunch of stuff for him because he feels they don't have the coverage they need, but the HOA boards look at price, & while I am very competive on my pricing, I do price to do the job properly.
  6. Mr.Markus

    Mr.Markus PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 5,779

    Is that a good rate in your neighbourhood for 2 blowers, 2 trucks, 1 kubota rtv w/Boss v, and a JD tractor w/loader and blower. $115/hr. ?????

    On edit: man hours I read it wrong.
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2011
  7. swtiih

    swtiih PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,179

    increase your price by 10% and require a multi year contract. sounds like you know what your cost are so why should you lower them to compete with someone who has no insurance
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2011
  8. Army Vet

    Army Vet Member
    Messages: 47

    Got a call this evening from the property manager.

    So the manager called about 5:00p.m. and was pissed with the situation! He can't believe what the owners did. They have now told him, he must be up during the entire snow event to monitor this "fly by night outfit" and make sure they are performing. I told him to just fire them after the first snow and then his headaches would be gone. He then wanted to know what our price would be to take over the rest of the year if it was to happen. I said it would be around $3000.00. Due to having to sub out other resi work and shuffling crews around to have theirs finished by 7a.m. . Is this out of line?
  9. mnglocker

    mnglocker Senior Member
    Messages: 923

    Not at all. Stupid should hurt, besides you now have to dick around with your schedule.
  10. Spucel

    Spucel Senior Member
    Messages: 413

    Gotta love stupid people

    Your first price was $2,600.00
    Your new price is $3,000.00

    Tell him you will split the difference with him for a 3 year deal. He can rest assured he wont have to deal with the BS for the next 3 years.
  11. swtiih

    swtiih PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,179

    time will tell. hopefully the next snowfall you get hammered & this new guy walks
  12. Army Vet

    Army Vet Member
    Messages: 47

    This is a perfect idea! I will do it as soon as possible! The 200.00 increase over three years each time it snows, will for sure make up for the headaches. I just wish the owners would have seen how stupid their thought process is on hiring this JACK WAGON!Thumbs Up
  13. thelettuceman

    thelettuceman PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,218

    Go with post # 10
  14. agree with 10. Just curious how are you doing 2500-3000 worth of snow removal and only 300 of salting? Are you only salting walkways or something?
  15. Army Vet

    Army Vet Member
    Messages: 47

    It is only walks and stairs for salt per the owner! If I had it my way I would do all of it with sand and salt for liability. It is their butts on the line now. When we get called in, which will happen that will be one of the first things brought up!
  16. TPC Services

    TPC Services Senior Member
    Messages: 875

    So was your price to do both properties?? A little confused because you start off with a apt complex and then a commercail property.
    Whats the company's name trugreen?? :mechanic: sounds like a trugreen price to me.:realmad:
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2011
  17. Army Vet

    Army Vet Member
    Messages: 47

    It was to do both the complex and comm lot. We were doing the walks with the Kubota and spreader in the rear.

    You are close to target on TG they are big low ballers in the area.

    Now I am going to sub out the F250\SD with the Western Plow. I just need to find someone in the greater DSM area looking for a sub.

    So it's on to plan B or C for now. I don't think I will take their call this winter when they need 911 service. It will be to much of a hassle, if I find work for all the equipment. I will not put the screws to someone else for their stupidity!ussmileyflag
  18. TPC Services

    TPC Services Senior Member
    Messages: 875

    So who did take it from you so I can keep a look out for them? I would bail them out since they are in your town, right? But like most have said on here I would sign a multi year contract with them. I wouldn't really jack the price on them you have had them for a long time. If you are going to jack the price on them they may try this again next year. Yes you have to rearranged your plans and stuff, Yes it will be a headache But I take them back on. I wouldn't though take my good crew off the new places or other places you still have to cover for their stupidity. I would hire some subs and seasonal guys to do these properties, put a person I can trust in charge of them and have at making the extrra $$
  19. bdover21

    bdover21 Member
    from Iowa
    Messages: 31

    Still looking for a sub in DSM Army Vet?
  20. mjcp

    mjcp Junior Member
    Messages: 24

    I enjoyed reading this thread.
    Although I only plow my own property, I have 17 years experience in corporate sales.
    Even if this guy comes back to you, YOU don't need his business.
    He will always be looking for you to come down in price and will leave you everytime someone offers him a deal. If he stays with you - it will eat him up that he is "Overpaying" and he will become more and more demanding as he tries to get his "moneys worth" out of you. You will spend more time reselling him, and babysitting his issues, that could be spent looking for a new account.

    The other benefit to leaving him, is that he is the perfect customer to let your competition have. He will put them out of business for you.