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Insurance - new plower

Discussion in 'Business Fundamentals' started by Jeffko, Nov 16, 2004.

  1. Jeffko

    Jeffko Junior Member
    Messages: 2

    In the past I have plowed for a friend with his truck, but this year I have found a deal on a '93 Bronco with a western Unimount and was thinking of buying it and working as a sub. They pay $60 an hour. What I was shocked to find was the cost of insurance. A "business' policy is about $120 more(for 6 months) than a personal one which I can handle, but my agent says I also need General Liability at a cost of $692(policy for 12 weeks). He says that "auto insurance does not cover you at any time the plow is on the ground" , only when going to and from a site. I don't plan on doing any lots on my own, only sub-contracting. I'd like to hear from others who sub, and if they carry General Liability. With the snows we get in Missouri some years, it seems it may take quite a while to make a profit with these insurance rates, equipment costs, etc. If anyone could help before I jump in with both feet and lose money??? :confused: Thank you
  2. Mick

    Mick PlowSite.com Veteran
    from Maine
    Messages: 5,546

    Your insurance agent is steering you right. You will need both Commercial Vehicle and General Liability insurance.

    Puts a whole different light on "just plowing snow", doesn't it?
  3. DJL

    DJL Senior Member
    Messages: 343

    I think that is a bunch of crap about once your plow is on the ground auto doesn't apply. If you ram your plow into a pole with it down I don't think G&L covers it. Auto does. But what do i know, I'm not an agent.

    But yes, you need both.
  4. cgillispn

    cgillispn Member
    Messages: 38

    wouldnt he be covered under whoever he is working for? they should be the ones that have to buy the insurance
  5. Jeffko

    Jeffko Junior Member
    Messages: 2

    [QUOTE=cgillispn]wouldnt he be covered under whoever he is working for? they should be the ones that have to buy the insurance[/QUOTE]

    I guess that's kind of my question. Would the company that I sub for responsible for general liability since I am working for them at their customers sites? Or would an injured party be able to go after me as well?
  6. james731

    james731 Member
    from ny
    Messages: 71

    an injured party is going to go after everyone they can

    everyones out for the easy buck
  7. DJL

    DJL Senior Member
    Messages: 343

    to CYA, at least the best that you can, when subbing for someone have the contractor sign a document stating that he carries liability and you are responsible for damages caused only from your vehicle and/or plow.
  8. ratlover

    ratlover PlowSite.com Addict
    from IL
    Messages: 1,325

    When looking into insurance and looking at my then currnet policy I was told by my insurance man that although i would be covered for my truck getting wrecked if I was transporting or plowing(wouldnt have any slip and fall type covereage) that after they paid they would drop me. I was told they would fix my truck and what ever I hit but I was told if I thought my rates were high now they wouldnt be anything compared to what i would pay if a co droped me. I dont believe at the time he was blowing sunshine up my skirt. Most guys that are bringing on subs require that you have proof that you are covered if you whack a car while plowing but a slip and fall comes back on them. Or so I believe. Look at how your contract is set up though.....

    Does the above sound right? Insurance always seems like another language to me :confused: I assume that right now I am covered but you never know what loop holes the insurance man will try to bring up whan something happens :angry:

    This post may be good to be sticky ;)
  9. crashz

    crashz Senior Member
    Messages: 256

    This has been bothering me as well. My GMC has commerical tags and I have plowing insurance (commercial) through my auto insurance carrier. The truck gets rarely used and only as a sub for my father's business, where he holds both GL and a contractors bond. Am I going about this correctly? Should I have GL as well? My truck is only a back up vehicle, in fact it barely pays for its own insurance and tags.

    So the big question here is:

    If you only sub for a contractor with their own GL (your truck being insured for plowing), do you need GL to protect you in a slip & fall? Or does the contractor's GL take the responsiblity?
  10. Mick

    Mick PlowSite.com Veteran
    from Maine
    Messages: 5,546

    No insurance company is going to "take" responsibility. In any action, the lawyer is going to go after anyone and everyone he can think of. Then let the judge sort it out. Even a sub should have GL insurance - "just in case".

    As many times as this gets asked, it seems that people are wanting confirmation that they really don't need insurance - let the "other guy" worry about it. "Aint gonna happen".
  11. JustUsDe

    JustUsDe Senior Member
    Messages: 181

    It seams many here do not understand the term sub or sub-contractor. When you sub for someone you are a contractor and you are required to have commercial auto insurance and GL insurance. You are not an employee for a contractor if you are a sub therefore their GL does not cover you!!! If you sub for me you are required to give me a certificate of proof and I must give a copy to my insurance company. If not, you don't sub for me. It's that simple. I am not the only contractor with this policy..

  12. crashz

    crashz Senior Member
    Messages: 256

    Thanks for the straight up replies Mick & JustUsDe.

    My "gray area" is that the truck is parked at my father's garage 150 miles away. therefore when it snows and he needs it when his trucks break down, he is the one driving it. I rarely get the chance to plow with my own truck due to my 9-5 job and living so far away. So subbing I guess is the wrong word. Renting is more like it. I used to think I was OK. My father plows with it, he's got GL, my truck is commercially insured and tagged, and he is included on my policy as a primary driver. But now its nagging me. I think I'll take this up with my insurance co. and maybe my father's. Maybe they can include my truck under his policy? Or maybe that can cut me a deal since my father insures his excavation business through them.
  13. DJL

    DJL Senior Member
    Messages: 343


    Very, very well put. The way things SHOULD be done!

    POWER WAGON Junior Member
    Messages: 13

    I have great news, I just saved a bunch of money on my car insurance

    I just spoke to an agent this morning. Erie insurance group. I almost fell off the chair when he told me the price. With general liability(2,000,000 dollar coverage)and Commercial vehicle policy(2 trucks) totaling $1,400-$1,600 PER YEAR!!!!! This is actully CHEAPER than what I was paying for one truck with state minimum coverage. What do you guys think about that.
  15. Young Pup

    Young Pup PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 5,522

    I think I am going to call Erie insurance on Thursday is what I think about that. Thanks for the information.

  16. DJL

    DJL Senior Member
    Messages: 343

    Be extremely carefull about changing insurance companies just to save a few bucks. Keep in mind what the insurance company is rated at. Your agent should be able to provide you with this. This will give you an idea of how fast they pay claims, whether or not they pay the claim and then get rid of you, etc. etc. etc.
  17. Young Pup

    Young Pup PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 5,522


    I am thinking of just getting a quote on inusrance. I would not change insurance right now going into plowing. I have a good track record with my company now and my insurance is paid in full. Anyway my agent told me he would do some shopping around for me in 2005. I just want something to have in the back of my mind when he comes back with some other prices.
  18. DJL

    DJL Senior Member
    Messages: 343

    My post was not meant for anyone in particular. Just a caution. Grass is always greenier on the other side.