1. Welcome to PlowSite. Notice a fresh look and new features? It’s now easier to share photos and videos, find popular topics fast, and enjoy expanded user profiles. If you have any questions, click HELP at the top or bottom of any page, or send an email to help@plowsite.com. We welcome your feedback.

    Dismiss Notice

I just don't get it

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by Ipushsnow, Dec 7, 2009.

  1. Ipushsnow

    Ipushsnow Senior Member
    Messages: 314

    Please, please, please explain this to me.

    Bid on a government job, 240,000 square feet (about 6 acres) of pretty wide open parking lots and driveways. Pretty straight forward plowing, minimal back dragging and obstacles. About 2,000 feet of sidewalks. 1" daytime trigger, 2" night time and weekend trigger. Salt on lots, calcium on walks. We get about 50" of snow per year, although the last 2 years we have gotten a lot more.

    Total 3 year contract, bids supposed to be for 3 years total. 5 bids were submitted, 1 over $200k, 1 over $100k, 1 about $80k, 2 at about $60k. Winner got it for $59,970, or about $20,000 per year.

    Based on my calculations, this lot would require a dedicated pick up with 8' V plow, and snow blower guy. Roughly 2 tons of salt and 20 bags of calcium per event. (Some of the walks are fairly wide, but not allowed to use a truck on them.)

    Contractor has to have 5 million umbrella insurance, required licenses, workers comp, all the usual for a government contract.

    So how can you bid a job like this, with these requirements for $20,000 per year, and still make money???????????????????????? I mean even if you drive your own paid off truck and strap the snow blower on your wife or teenage kid how the F*(% can people bid that low and survive? $20,000 minus insurance, minus what you pay people, minus salt,minus calcium (which we all know aint cheap), minus maintenance,.........HOW???
  2. asps4u

    asps4u Senior Member
    Messages: 543

    Who said they will survive? Unless it's just three years worth of beer money!:dizzy: Don't be shocked when it's up for bid again next year :nod:
  3. xtreem3d

    xtreem3d PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,548

    just going by some prices i have seen posted here
    20 bags calc @ 12.00 = 240 x 20 events = 4800.00
    2 tons salt @ 80 = 160 x 20 events = 3200.00
    so far $8000.00 in material not including , ;labor, gas , parts ect

    i guess only you know how many events would actually occur?
  4. xtreem3d

    xtreem3d PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,548

    can you say which bid was yours?
  5. creativedesigns

    creativedesigns PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,929

    Or for that matter, up for bid quarter way thru the season!
  6. blowerman

    blowerman PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,275

    Was that the MMSD contract?
  7. nsmilligan

    nsmilligan PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 704

    I count, there were 4 bids at 80K or less, ( or I guess the winner was 1 0f 2 at about 60K), so If there where 6 bids, 66% of the bidders are counting on global warming! If 5 bids only 60%:D

  8. Ipushsnow

    Ipushsnow Senior Member
    Messages: 314

    20 events would be a good estimate. I usually count on 20 plowings and 25 saltings a year. YES blowerman, MMSD. Did you guys bid on it??
  9. blowerman

    blowerman PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,275

    I passed... Knowing those type of contracts, they generally go very cheap. Longea29 had looked at a few school district style bids in our area and said they went real cheap. I look for mid level buildings, multi-tenants and condos. Get em big enough that the little guy can't do them and the big players don't have much interest in them.
  10. Ipushsnow

    Ipushsnow Senior Member
    Messages: 314

    Did you happen to see the the bids for doing that Coggs Health Center place on the north side? Here is what the "Winner" bid to get the job. This is cut and past right out of the city's website. I DID NOT MAKE THESE NUMBERS UP!!

    Pick-up Truck with 8’ plow Hourly Rate $39

    1-Ton Truck with 9’ plow Hourly Rate $42

    Dump Truck with 10’ or greater plow Hourly Rate $45

    Skidster with push bucket/snow bucket Hourly Rate $46

    Snow shovelers with blowers or a.t.v. Hourly Rate $29

    Quad-axel Dump Truck for hauling Hourly Rate $75

    Loader with minimum 2-yard bucket Hourly Rate $75

    Snow Dumping Fee Per Load $0

    Material Salt Hand Applied Per Pound $.18

    Rock Salt on Drives and Lots Per Pound .09

    I gotta call this guy and have him sub out all my work so I can sell my trucks, quit answering the phone, and just roll over and go to sleep when the snow starts!
  11. Brant'sLawnCare

    Brant'sLawnCare PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,756

    It makes me sick when I see bidding that cheap. There is no way you can be honest with your hours and make money bidding like that. I was looking at the Slinger School District. The guy has trucks like mine, and he charges $55/hr. I figured for me at that rate, at best I would have $5 left over per hour. But probably not even that. I passed on the bid.
  12. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 645

    When its time to fix or replace they will rob Peter to pay Paul until Paul is broke too.:confused: