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how much salt / sand?

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by lawnboy82, Aug 13, 2001.

  1. lawnboy82

    lawnboy82 Banned
    Messages: 51

    well i am going to be getting about 75+ snow plowing customers for this winter. and the deal with them is this- plow driveway / shovel walk / ice control as needed. well what i would like to know is this. how much sand / salt would i need to cover about 75 or so small to medium size driveways, plus some small roads, and a small commercial here or there. i will be plowing with a ford f250 4x4 with a 7 1/2 or 8' plow. what should i be looking at for sand / salt supplies for 1 run, and what kind of sander? the guy tells me that he currently uses a tailgate sander. however that doesnt really seem like it would work to me. i could go and buy a big one though, however what do you guys think?
  2. Alan

    Alan PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,393

    Fill in the loaction in your profile, plese. Application rates will vary depending on your location as it affects normal temperatures when you get snow, as well as temperatures after a storm. Granted, thsoe are generalities but it will make a difference as what to use and how much.
  3. Mick

    Mick PlowSite.com Veteran
    from Maine
    Messages: 5,546

    Why wouldn't a tailgate sander work? Your reasoning for deciding that might help in giving you advise. And like Alan said, your location is going to have a lot to do with it.
  4. Rooster

    Rooster Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 650

    A small tailgate spreader should work in you situation.

    For a more precise answer, measure 3 or 4 of the drives. Then post the measurements, you know average can have different meanings in different parts of the U.S.

    That way those here can give you a better answer to suit your situation
  5. Taconic

    Taconic PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 180

    I agree with Rooster here as you mention small driveways and some small roads.That definition can be interpreted differently by others.Not trying to be difficult here but you should take some measurements,although like Alan said your area will help determine the volume you may need in material.Try to find out how many winter events you get each year and the type of events ie more rain than snow ,more snow than ice,how many ice storms.There are alot of factors which are different for all areas and when you know this information you will have a better feel for the types of material and amounts you may require.
    Taconic/NY Snow Pros
    John Parker
  6. bam

    bam Senior Member
    from .
    Messages: 201

    I would think from your description a tailgate might work better than a "v-box". Especially with your truck, an F-250. I have a new F-250 and I know my total payload is 2200lbs+-...If I were to put a plow, tools, myself, a helper?, then salt or sand and some sort of spreader my capacity would disappear in no time, and I would be overweight.

    It might also be more effective to purchase bagged materials for the type of sites you're planning on doing. You could load a pallet of salt on your truck, then possibly put a snowblower in there for your walks. If you went with a v-box I dont think you would have the space. Maintenance is also alot less on a mini spreader.

    However as the others have said, you really need to give a clearer definition of what sites your handling. And with the residential drives, is a homeowner going to pay for salting. Very few people at home used to salt/sand, they just shoveled and let mother nature do the rest.
  7. Chuck Smith

    Chuck Smith 2000 Club Member
    from NJ
    Messages: 2,317

    In Lawnboy82's Lawnsite profile, his location is listed as West Chester County, NY.....

    Maybe I'm wrong, but from Lawnboy's initial post, he is "getting" these accounts, and "getting" a plow. From another thread, it seems he needs a new truck as well. Lawnboy, do you have any snowplowing equipment or accounts now? Is this all speculation?

    I'm trying to keep up with all your posts here. Just trying to understand your situation.

  8. lawnboy82

    lawnboy82 Banned
    Messages: 51

    right now i have no truck. :( a friend of mine has a f250 he wants to sell me for 1000 dollars. that is not a problem for me. i am supposed to be going this weekend to look at the plowing accounts. that is something i have my doubts about. first the guy said you go onto one road and you do several, turn back onto the main road, turn onto the next road and do more. and back and forth and so on and so forth. at that time he said there were about 50 accounts. he had said that they all paid cash, and that there were some roads and commercials in it. now the last time i saw him about a week ago he said that it was 75+ accounts, and they are all on one road boom boom boom. so his story has me kind of doubtful that this will turn into anything. this is the reason right now why i dont have any idea what i am doing, getting out or staying in. i am not sure. i have never plowed snow before with a truck on my own. i have gone with people who plow, and i have gone out on my own with a snowblower. however this is completely different, and also in this case i will for the most part not be plowing. my friend has some guys from equador who will need jobs for the winter. so i will recruit them to plow. again everything is up in the air right now.
  9. Mick

    Mick PlowSite.com Veteran
    from Maine
    Messages: 5,546

    Lawnboy82 - For several reasons, I would strongly advise you not to go after this. First and foremost, you have neither the know how nor the resources for such an account. If you want to start plowing, get yourself a truck and plow. Then get supplemental plowing insurance if you don't have already and business insurance. Then take on two or three driveways and other plowing as people call you. Maybe by next year you'll be ready to take on something like that road and driveways.
  10. Rooster

    Rooster Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 650

    lawnboy 82,

    While you are getting your truck togeather with the plow and all, contact Chuck Smith, or SIMA you can purchase a book on snowplowing.

    I would have to say this is a must for first time plowing.
  11. 66Construction

    66Construction Senior Member
    Messages: 315

    Try getting a job working for someone else for a little while to get your feet wet. It's better to break someones elses equipment then to break your own. It cuts out the insurance need and a risk on your part. Then again you might be fine, my partner took my truck out last winter, he had never plowed before only seen me plow(similar to your situation) and did fine, cleared the lots decent and didn't break anything. In the end it's your rear end thais is just my thought.

    Oh yeah, I've never salted a residential account but for commercial I figure about 20 lbs. of pure salt per 1000 sf and it usualy does the walks and I have extra in case I run into trouble spots,(shade, etc.) The conditions realy dictate how much you need.
  12. lawnboy82

    lawnboy82 Banned
    Messages: 51

    thanx you guys. i went and talked with this guy today where he works. we are "meeting up on sunday" i am not gettin a good feeling about this because he doesnt want me to meet the customers yet, and he wants me to plow for him for the start of the season and he will pay me. i am gettin a fishy feeling about this. but- i would rather plow for him and get paid the full amount as opposed to buying the accounts and they all leave me. i am gonna meet up with him on sunday supposedly and see how that goes. i think its gonna wind up with me walking though. chuck- for right now it is all up in the air "speculation" the business insurance that i carry i specifically got to cover the 3 things i am into- tree work #1 landscaping was #2 and i got the snow plowing coverage just in case i wanted to get into it this year. so i am covered for it. John- i am gonna be plowing about 1 hr south of you. down in chappaqua. i am not sure if you are familiar with the area but it is $$$ so i am also lookin at these accounts for the landscaping potential. but, honestly i am very pesimistic if i want to do this. he would have to come up with a very nice agreement for me to go into it.
  13. John DiMartino

    John DiMartino PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 2,154

    I don't think your ready to bite this much off yet,I feel for 75 accounts of any size,you need a new or relatvely new truck,unless your a good mechanic,which your not.Then you need a reliable backup truck as well.i dont see how your going to service 75 accounts with one truck in a timely manner if we get more than a few inches of snow.I dont get a good feeling about this either.One of the get accounts from companys who cant get the job done on time,or break down with no backup.
  14. Alan

    Alan PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,393


    From the stuff you post over in Lawnsite you seem to be constantly in some sort of major fiasco. That tends to make me think that you are not very well aquainted wtih much of anything in the real world. Just how do you think you could ever service 75 accounts with one old junker? Or is this another of your big deals that will fall by the wayside? Please, if you're just another reincarnation of 9' Piles or Mike Smith from last year, find a life.
  15. lawnboy82

    lawnboy82 Banned
    Messages: 51

    thanx you guys- the guy was full of shot. he never called me either last night, today, or tonight. he had said he would and he didnt. i hate it when people promise me work, and then they keep promising and promising, and nothing ever comes from it. pisses me off. makes me not like people even more.
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 19, 2001
  16. Rob

    Rob PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 306

    Guess it was a good thing that he didn't call - seeing as you posted that you quit the business over on Lawnsite.

    No offense - just an observation.

    I wish you good luck in whatever you choose to pursue
  17. lawnboy82

    lawnboy82 Banned
    Messages: 51

    thanx rob- i am gettin out of the business- however i was hoping to line up that plowing route to give myself some extra cash. i had gone to the place the guy works at today- he told me he had to go away on business this weekend. i asked him hows about today- he said no- tomorow- he didnt know. as i was walkin out the boss' nephew told me not to trust the guy.
  18. Rob

    Rob PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 306

    Just going by what you've posted, it sounds like the guy is jerking you around. Do you still trust him not to 'steal' the customers back from you at this point ? What if you were to subcontract to the guy for a period of time ? You could learn the route and see how good the route realliy is, and not be stuck with it should it be not what it's being billed as.

    Just a thought,
  19. lawnboy82

    lawnboy82 Banned
    Messages: 51

    good idea rob- but i dont trust the guy- and his boss today told me not to trust him. i dont think the accounts ever existed.

    it pisses me off because- on mother's day i was cutting an account of mine, my parents were bugging me to get home- the guy's harley broke down accross from where i was cutting- asked me for a ride and i helped him out because his house was in the direction i was traveling anyways. as we were goin over to his house he is tellin me about all these plowing accounts he has, and that he wanted to get rid of. we exchanged numbers and he said he would "hook me up" i saw the guy a couple times over the past few months and he said the same thing "i am gonna hook you up" and good stuff about the accounts. then we were gonna meet up and he was gonna show me the accounts- oh i cant go this weekend- no big deal- and oh i cant go saturday, but sunday we can go. guy never called or anything. it really pisses me off that people do stuff like this. i gave him a ride- he could have just said thank you and that's it. but instead he was bull @#$ing me. and wasted my time, and i wasted you guys' time because i really thought that the accounts were gonna be mine because that was what the guy said.
  20. 75

    75 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,382

    And the saga continues.............................. :rolleyes: