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Client had two companies plowing for one storm :/

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by Ramairfreak98ss, Jan 23, 2010.

  1. Ramairfreak98ss

    Ramairfreak98ss PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,931

    So ive spoken with the client several times now.

    The owner of a liquor store, large one in a strip mall, we handle the whole place, said after the big dec 19th storm, that the place looked great, thrilled with the service etc. At least some positive notes here compared to our other site troubles this season. BUT, they had to cancel the contract because apparently the "new" store, had a contractor handling the snow through the original builder?

    I dont know 100% of the details, but apparently after getting our 5k invoice, another company claims they plowed 2-3 times and put down salt as well for 2k more lol.

    Of course, they don't want to pay the bill now because of this. They seem to trust our invoice even though they had 10 million questions about it. Im going to guess at this point that hopefully theyll pay the bill soon, yet its due for net 30 in 7 days now.

    Dont know how this is our fault at all. Of course since we state we plowed 4" or 7" etc, im sure their numbers dont line up from times with this other company claiming they were plowing too. I never saw salt or indication of anyone else plowing when i was onsite 2-3 times in the course of the nearly 3 days worked there nor did our other crew/plow driver think that anyone else ever plowed.

    This other company hasnt supplied them with "times" or accumulation amounts though so maybe this info will help us and be "professional" in this particular clients eyes. We had this account on contract for this season early too, since early October 2009.
  2. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 645

    Do you have ANY accounts where is everything is going well?
  3. quigleysiding

    quigleysiding PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,129

    How could someone else plow and salt and you or your guys never have noticed?
  4. Silverado_guy07

    Silverado_guy07 Member
    Messages: 34

    I had it happen at one of my commercial accounts last year. LOL
    The contractor next doors subs didnt realise that there were two different propertys connected together through the parking lot and plowed my lot along with theirs. hahaha
    I only wish they never realised cuz they did mid december
  5. BigLou80

    BigLou80 Senior Member
    Messages: 558

    I don't get it??? I really just don't get it!!!!! Are you making these stories up ? how is it possible to have so many problems ?

    Do you have a contract? Does the "other company" have a contract ? What does the original builder have to do with it ? does he still own the property ? If so who is your contract with ? who is the other guys contract with ?

    If the builder has a snow contract and he no longer owns the property its his porblem to pay his plower.

    Does the liquor store owner own the property ? If not why is he contracting with you ? Even so if he has a contract with you he needs to pay you, or prove you didn't perform the service he contracted with you for.

    Google " unjust enrichment"
  6. clark lawn

    clark lawn PlowSite.com Addict
    from NE ohio
    Messages: 1,233

    whos contract was signed first? if it was yours it stick to your guns. if they have had to take care of their own lot in the past and wernt notified that that was changing then the problem lies with the property owner and them.
  7. procut

    procut Senior Member
    Messages: 903

    Good god, you sure do have your share of problems.

    If you nor any of your empoyees noticed any evidence of any plowing or salting I would have to say the other compnay is trying to pull a fast one and try to pass off what you did as something that they did, bill them for it hopefully get paid.
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2010
  8. dlcs

    dlcs 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,160

    Have you ever went by the name Bobbygedd over on Lawnsite?
  9. Dstosh

    Dstosh Senior Member
    Messages: 534

    Oh man now that was funny!
  10. procut

    procut Senior Member
    Messages: 903

    LMAO, your right this is like something he would post.
  11. Ramairfreak98ss

    Ramairfreak98ss PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,931

    Thats exactly my point, but client probably thinks "we are" billing him for our guys showing up and "noticing its plowed" so we charged them anyway, who knows. They're really lost in the situation.

    They need to tell the other company to go pound sand and pay our bill.
  12. Ramairfreak98ss

    Ramairfreak98ss PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,931

    And think of it this way, if your crew shows up to plow the property under contract, and its already plowed, Id certainly charge them for a plow anyway, but id get it cleared up prior to the next storm.

    Lets just say that the other contractor plowed our lot 100% of the storm, our crew shows up several times and its done and so we don't get paid anything for that storm? If we are contracted for the work, damn straight were going to be paid for the site.
  13. Ramairfreak98ss

    Ramairfreak98ss PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,931

    I know its like dumb and dumber in nj for us right now. I dont think we've had as many problems in the last few years doing commercial snow as this year already. We have a contract signed in early october, i "think" this other contractor already has a contract as well, but the owner had no idea about it.. so im told. Dont know what the builder has to do with it, guesssing thats how the owner didnt know about this company until after the storm lol.
    Our contract is through the liquor store and the owner himself. And i agree, the builder or whomoever else involved should pay that company, not the owner of the store now. The liquor store owns the whole property and the strip mall thing. There is a subway, and a fitness place built into the side of it with a couple other small stores. ill do the google lol.
  14. hydro_37

    hydro_37 PlowSite Veteran
    from iowa
    Messages: 3,790

    WOW....If I had that much to complain about I would quit plowing....lol
    Have you EVER posted anything good?
  15. Ramairfreak98ss

    Ramairfreak98ss PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,931

    lol, ive read the stuff hes posted over there in the past, no same name on lawnsite too :p

    Since its taken him from December 22nd to now and he still doesnt have the full bill, times or paperwork from this other contractor xyz company, im going to guess its either a stall tactic or they just are really confused with the situation. They had 30 days to pay from December 29th 2009 invoice. their last service was 12/23/09, the very end of that big storm, they called us the next day AFTER they called the day prior saying how great everything was.
  16. Ramairfreak98ss

    Ramairfreak98ss PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,931

    well we are profitable with snow... so that much is going well :/ But this past storm was pretty nasty to us. It seemed like one thing after another

    Broken plow, 2x, broken spreader chute- replaced, truck stuck -got out eventually, tractor got hit, property entance plowed in by 16' pushbox loaders from the mall across the street...

    Part of the problem was one new "reputable" plow driver basically said he was tired and quit when i called him in at 4am saturday morning.... we dropped the truck off at his house not too far from us the day prior too, so we were down a truck and driver to start.. Then one of my landscape crew drivers just never calls back after i talk to him the day prior, still have not talked to him to this day... scratch his name off the list.

    Two laborers bailed at the last minute too, scratched them off. Wasnt a good start, lots got broken, guys hit curbs etc where no markers were, probably stolen, just as the ones we put out last week i noticed are gone already.
  17. forestfireguy

    forestfireguy PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,276


    You need back up plans for your back up plans, to do this kind of work you have to have plans at least two deep for everything, people, trucks, blowers,gas stations, salt suppliers.................

    How long have you been doing snow? Brings me back to the growing pains question. Did you grow ALOt this year? If so maybe too much............
  18. BigLou80

    BigLou80 Senior Member
    Messages: 558

    OK still not sure I am any better off for reading that but anyhow.

    Will mr liquor store owner give you the name of the other company ? I think that maybe the owner is trying to pull one over on you, so he can hire a cheaper guy but I could be all wrong. If you can get the name of the other guy I would give him a call and ask who his contract is with might be some revealing information there. I would think If his contract was with the builder then his bill would go to the builder, not the new property owner unless they are one and the same or there was contract language about this in the construction agreement (which I highly doubt).

    If you did the work and have the documentation to prove it and they needed/wanted the work done. Then you need to get paid. Thats what the googling is about. Even if you didn't have a contract you would still have a court case to get paid.

    Do you have a termination clause in your contract ? If not you might want to add one. With out one they are probably free to Ieave at any time. I don't know about NJ but in Massachusetts there are no liquidated damages only proven sustainted loss. In laymans terms. you can't charge some one to get out of a contract unless you can prove them breaking the contract cost you money. Which while not impossible may be very difficult and time consuming to do. That being said, I would still put it in my contract anyhow to discourage anyody from leaving mid season, although you may not want a client who does not want you. You can put anything you want in a contract, but not all of it will past muster and be enforcable in a court room.

    Maybe you knew all that and I just took a few minutes of your life you will never get back
  19. buckwheat_la

    buckwheat_la 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,254

    simply stated, isn't it up to the contractee, to know who is hired for snow removal, i have been double booked before too, not my fault, not the fault of the other contractor either. it is the responsibilty of the owner/property manager to be up on what is going on, with that being said, be understanding here, if there is a honest mistake, and they pay you up, give them a break getting out of their contract, they well hopefully remember you for it.
  20. ColumbiaLand

    ColumbiaLand Senior Member
    Messages: 790

    Sounds to me that you need a serious lawyer for all of these problems with contracts and other companies that you continue to have.