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Your bid

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by Elegant Greens, Sep 17, 2015.

  1. Elegant Greens

    Elegant Greens Junior Member
    Messages: 7

    http://www.mapdevelopers.com/area_f...3608],[42.15831501877721,-83.24507580535283]]


    Please tell me your bid for the above link. Prices in my area are $159 per yard of salt just to purchase, since we don't have a very big yard to store it at. Company location is Woodhaven Michigan. We charge $100 per acre for plowing and $35 per man hour for sidewalks, it seems like I am getting under bidded on everything I bid on that is above an acre by a significant amount. However, we don't have anything that is more than an acre currently. Please take the time to tell me what you would bid this property at for a monthly estimate Nov 15 - April 15 and how many pushes and or salting's your price includes, also make the price include the sidewalks being cleared. No need for bashing, just curious as to what others would charge is all, because I must be above the market range when it comes to bigger properties. Thanks!
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2015
  2. Buswell Forest

    Buswell Forest PlowSite.com Addict
    from NH
    Messages: 1,668

    The link shows me a blue trapezoid. I try to make $150 per hour.
    So if I could clear 2 acres in an hour, they would be priced at $75 per acre. Walks? No advice there. Still learning.
     
  3. Camden

    Camden PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 6,598

  4. Elegant Greens

    Elegant Greens Junior Member
    Messages: 7

    Yeah your right not easy but seems worth it. However, I just want to know what others bid it. As far as around the garages they said just do whatever you can to make it work. I have been golf carted around by property manager. Seems to be impossible to get properties like this around here because people are still bidding things like this for so little it's not worth the time to even do. That's why I am curious for other people's bids as well so I can at least get an idea as to what other people's overhead costs are compared to mine.
     
  5. dieselss

    dieselss PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,975

    so I can at least get an idea as to what other people's overhead costs are compared to mine.

    Can't compare YOUR overhead to others.
     
  6. 1olddogtwo

    1olddogtwo PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,535

    My overhead has a sunroof. It's about 16 by 28.

    We all have different cost. Some maybe mortgaged to their eyes, others may OWN their equipment and just have maintenance expenses
     
  7. Elegant Greens

    Elegant Greens Junior Member
    Messages: 7

    It's funny how this plowsite.com is to help people out and bounce ideas off one another. However, we still get people like you who ruin the site. Please keep all negative comments to yourself as it is not needed. I know everyone has their own costs, I have been doing this for 12 years now. I want to know what you would bid the property, nothing else.
     
  8. SnoFarmer

    SnoFarmer PlowSite Fanatic
    from N,E. MN
    Messages: 8,574

    Were not here to be your accountant,
    Were not here to run the numbers with you
    as we have no idea what they are.

    ok, I know one guy that gets over $250 an hr and a another that goes for $100 an hr.

    You pick.....
    You could go broke using ether number.

    we can help with a lot of things but unless you post up all of your costs associated with the industry your going into them we can't help.

    I dont think you know what your numbers are?
    or how you come to get them.
     
  9. dieselss

    dieselss PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,975

    Help people out? Really Clark?
    12years and your still asking for help? Must be doing something wrong IMO
    That's not what you asked. You asked what is your overhead!
     
  10. bhmjwp

    bhmjwp Senior Member
    from kcmo
    Messages: 309

    I know I should not even jump into this, But, who cares what anyone's overhead costs are. What matters is what the going bid rates are for the available properties to be bid. Called prevailing market rate.

    The only time you overhead costs come into play is to determine whether you gain money or lose money net. Makes it hard to justify $40.000 truck in some markets. I currently walk away from 75% of open bids, money just not there net.

    You must know you costs, but your cost will not determine market rates.
     
  11. SnoFarmer

    SnoFarmer PlowSite Fanatic
    from N,E. MN
    Messages: 8,574

    threads like this have everything to do with operating cost and most of the time they are posted by someone who has no idea what to bid and wants to use your bid #'s so they dont have to do their homework.

    Your overhead ie cost of doing business matters 100% of the time.
     
  12. snowman55

    snowman55 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,071

    Agreed. but I will say that owning equipment verses having payments has nothing to do with overhead.

    $40,000 truck with payment. Overhead is the maintenance and the depreciation and interest of the asset. 10 year life on truck makes depreciation $4,000 a year + maintenance I usually ballpark maintenance at 1/2 dep so $2000 a year. Your overhead is $6,000 a year

    $20,000 truck paid for but used has a 5 year life = $4000 a year depreciation and maintenance cost will be higher because it is used so $2500 a year in maint =$6500 in overhead.

    Overhead is different then cash flow. Truck payments are not an expense, they are a reduction in equity not a reduction of profit.
     
  13. iceyman

    iceyman 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,546

    Lies!!! Just give him a dam number already ;)
     
  14. Elegant Greens

    Elegant Greens Junior Member
    Messages: 7

    I asked what you would bid the property. Why are you even putting this useless information on the thread? I didn't ask for it. If you do not have a number figure that you are writing on this thread of what you would bid it, please don't spam the thread with information not requested.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2015
  15. SnoFarmer

    SnoFarmer PlowSite Fanatic
    from N,E. MN
    Messages: 8,574

    Seeing as we are playing in fantasy land.
    You would pay them a kings ransom for just the opportunity.

    so I should sit down and do the paperwork for however long it takes and give you a bid?
    sorry, im not doing the excursive so i can play in your sand box.

    ya have to take what ya get,

    go fish.
    ps your equipment cost is part of your overhead, operating costs.

    Depreciation is not all it's cracked up to be.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2015
  16. ryde307

    ryde307 PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,143

    This is useful information that many do not understand.

    To the OP. When compairing this site to a open parking lot and using a metric of acres or Sqft to get a price you will be all over the place. Break it down.
    How many hours will it take to plow? multiply that by the equipment needed.
    you now have machine hours. multiply that by your rates.

    Do the same with shoveling and salt. You now have a price.

    A town home complex like that could go for $30 a unit in MN and $75 a unit in NY. (these are made up #'s) So unless someone from your specific market chimes in it's not worth alot for people to give you numbers. The best people can do is help you figure out your numbers.

    You also failed to mention the scope of work. When does it get plowed? does it need daytime service? Do you plow at the end of a snow event or during? Same with shoveling and salting when do you do it?
     
  17. dieselss

    dieselss PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,975

    so I can at least get an idea as to what other people's overhead costs are compared to mine.

    Right from your post.


    Why are you even putting this useless information on the thread? I didn't ask for it.

    Again you asked for it
     
  18. BossPlow2010

    BossPlow2010 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,035

    You're paying 150$ a yard for salt?!
     
  19. SnoFarmer

    SnoFarmer PlowSite Fanatic
    from N,E. MN
    Messages: 8,574

    Since 1987, the IRS has imposed luxury limits for automobiles.

    As most of us use there truck out side of work,'


    (The depreciation limits for trucks and vans are a little bit higher, and there are special rules if the truck has a gross weight of more than 6,000 pounds)


    You can only write-off 100% if the vehicle is used 100% for business AND you buy it brand new from the dealer (no private party used vehicle).
    1) 100% business use, if not the ratio used for business is deductible e.g. 65% for business use, 65% depreciation/deduction schedule. Keep a mileage log! It’s generally impossible to have 100% business use -

    It’s important to note the IRS screens small businesses based on expense and tax ratios for auditing. If your business only brings in $30,000 gross revenue a year, then buying a $75,000 truck amortized over four years is probably going to raise red flags. But if you have a $250,000 gross revenue a year business, then writing off $10,000 – $45,000 a year in expenses doesn’t seem out of line. The IRS is on the look out for small businesses that are created simply to dump lifestyle expenses into the entity to reduce income taxes. -

    remember those who heavily desperate their vehicles run them into the ground, ie use them up until they are not moving any longer.

    What about preventing loss when selling a depreciated asset?

    ok now you have deprecated your truck.

    Now its time to sell or get rid of it.

    "When a business buys an asset that should last more than one year, the Internal Revenue Service generally requires that the asset be depreciated. Depreciation spreads the item's cost out over its life, simulating its gradual deterioration or obsolescence. When you sell an a depreciated asset, it could be a taxable event if you sell it for more than its depreciated value."

    When you sell a depreciated asset, any profit relative to the item's depreciated price is a capital gain.

    Selling Depreciated Assets

    When you sell a depreciated asset, any profit relative to the item's depreciated price is a capital gain. For example, if you buy a computer workstation for $2,000, depreciate it down to $800 and sell it for $1,200, you will have a $400 gain that is subject to tax. These rules also apply to items on which you have claimed bonus depreciation or a Section 179 deduction. If you used the Section 179 deduction, for example, to write down the cost of the computer to nothing and sold it for $1,200, the entire selling price would be a taxable gain.


    so yea none of it matters, everyones numbers are the same along with income...
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2015
  20. terrapro

    terrapro PlowSite Veteran
    from MI
    Messages: 3,878

    $159 a yard of salt?!?! You are either BSing us or you are blind and being majorly ripped off. That was the price in mid and east MI 2 years ago and maybe a little bit last season. Shop around.
    Are you buying 50lb bags?

    $100 per acre is pretty cheap and so is $35 an hour for walks. If you can't pay a guy $15-25 an hour you aren't charging enough.