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V plow vs Single blade with rear plow

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by AB Lawn Care, Oct 7, 2000.

  1. AB Lawn Care

    AB Lawn Care Member
    Messages: 93

    Which set up would be cheaper and which would be faster?Anyone have any ideas?
     
  2. plowking35

    plowking35 2000 Club Member
    from SE CT
    Messages: 2,923

    V plow would be cheaper, and unless you have a ton of back dragging to do, almost as fast.
    In forward mode the v plow will rock all comers.And with dbl acting cylinders or cylinder locks, they will back drag fine.
    Dino
     
  3. Lazer

    Lazer Senior Member
    Messages: 399

    Of course you get BOTH. The increased production will pay for the additional equipment in the first season, future seasons will enjoy increased profits.
     
  4. GeoffD

    GeoffD PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 2,266

    If your a 1 or 2 man show. V plows are the only way to go. However if you are running multiple trucks, there are some jobs streight blades work well on. Granted over the next couple years i will have more v plows. Last year i had 2 fisher v plows bought in 97 when they first came out. However i didn't buy any till this year when i bough 2 9.5' fisher v plows this year. All of my residential driveways are done with streight blades, the reason is, they work well in this application. There are only a few residentials that i have that the v-plow would save time.

    Geoff
     
  5. Aspen Snow

    Aspen Snow Senior Member
    Messages: 148

    We have one V-plow in our fleet. But I am thinking of purchusing another for our 2wd Cab-over. I would work great in alot of our Commerical Accounts.
     
  6. John Allin

    John Allin PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,327

    V plow - all the way.
     
  7. Ed Altheide

    Ed Altheide Junior Member
    Messages: 16

    I agree with Lazer. A front plow with $200 dollar pro wings
    and a back plow would be the most efficient. I have asked
    snowplowers in the Grand Rapids area that own both straight blades w/pro wings and V plows...they say that the straight blades with pro wings carries the larger load. Has anyone else had this same comparison?

    With the back plow you'll be carrying a second load across the lot and scraping cleaner(hydraulic down pressure)as you go ...requiring less de-icing material. You will also eliminate all your time consuming back dragging and turn around time.

    Good Luck with your decision!

    Ed Altheide
    http://www.snowmansnowplow.com
     
  8. Chuck Smith

    Chuck Smith 2000 Club Member
    from NJ
    Messages: 2,317

    Ed,

    This doesn't make sense to me.

    "With the back plow you'll be carrying a second load across the lot and scraping cleaner(hydraulic down pressure)as you go ...requiring less de-icing material."

    Two things come to mind.
    1. Doing a lot, the front blade would scrape clean, or almost clean.

    2. With the rear plow down, you'd leave a "trail off" trail, or even 2 trails if you kept the rear plow in the straight position.

    It sounds like using a rear plow on a lot with a front plow, would make a mess. Having never used the 2 together, I can't say for sure, just a feeling I have. Not only that, but you'd wear out 2 cutting edges at the same time.

    I have a feeling that the "load" in front of the rear plow would be lost to trail off on every pass. Now a set of wings on a rear plow, well, that sounds like it would work for doing lots. At least the wings would help stop trail off.

    ~Chuck
     
  9. Ed Altheide

    Ed Altheide Junior Member
    Messages: 16

    Chuck,

    A front plow is going to carry one load across the lot. When using a front/back plow combination the same truck will carry two loads across the lot.

    The best example of scraping cleaner that I have is a Super Wal-Mart we contract with. These lots have traffic on them 24 hours/day and the snow tends to get packed. Our front plows won't pick up the packed snow and ice. We use the back plow with 1280# hydraulic down pressure at the cutting edge and get a much cleaner surface. It's the same concept as the state DOT trucks with the belly scrapers.

    We're in the third year contract with Wal-Mart. At the time of acceptance they stated that we were significantly higher than the other bids but retained us because of the quality of service we are able to provide.

    Ed
     
  10. Chuck Smith

    Chuck Smith 2000 Club Member
    from NJ
    Messages: 2,317

    Ed,

    You still didn't say if trail off occurs. It seems to me since it does with a front plow in a straight position, it would with a rear plow in a straight position.
    Am I wrong?
    Do you have rear plows that can be angled?

    ~Chuck
     
  11. Ed Altheide

    Ed Altheide Junior Member
    Messages: 16

    Sorry about that. Yes, trail off occurs if your back plow gets too full. Extension wings will help, they ad 1 1/2' to the length.

    Yes, we have power angle pull plows. They are designed with spring power down pressure.

    Ed
    http://www.snowmansnowplow.com
     
  12. Lazer

    Lazer Senior Member
    Messages: 399

    All out trucks are equipped with rear plows: 2240# downpressure.
     
  13. Ed Altheide

    Ed Altheide Junior Member
    Messages: 16

    down pressure

    Lazer,
    What is the down pressure applied at the cutting edge? Is your systems a single cylinder or twin? Our SC models offer one cylinder with a pump setting of 1450#. Our applied pressure is up to 1280#. We have yet to scale our twin system. If you can get to a scale I would like to hear the results. By the way what brand or have you made these yourself?

    Ed
    http://www.snowmansnowplow.com
     
  14. Lazer

    Lazer Senior Member
    Messages: 399

    We've been manufacturing out own rear plows for 20 years.

    Our pressure is possible because of the central hydraulic system. It will lift the rear tires off the ground if put down all the way.
     
  15. JCurtis

    JCurtis Banned
    Messages: 862

    I personally haven't used a back plow, however I have heard that not only are they good for pulling snow away from garage doors and loading docks, but they are supposedly very good on curved driveways or roadways. It has something to do with the tracking of the vehicle. what the front blade misses, in a curve , the back blade picks up.

    John Parker just bought one for one of his trucks, saw it this past weekend. Guess he will let us know how or if it works.
     
  16. Lazer

    Lazer Senior Member
    Messages: 399

    A rear plow on a circle driveway allows you to clear inside where the truck wheels track. You can't with a front plow.

    With our new setups, we use the front plow 15-25% of the time on BOTH commercial and residential.

    I'm not about to do-away with our front plows, but they are now the least important part of our snowplow operation.
     
  17. Chuck Smith

    Chuck Smith 2000 Club Member
    from NJ
    Messages: 2,317

    A front plow allows you to push snow up onto grass areas when plowing residential accounts, a rear plow doesn't.
    Around here all the snow must remain on the property. Pushing snow into the street, or across it, results in a $500 fine on Town roads, and a $700 fine on County roads.

    I guess each plow has it's merits.

    ~Chuck
     
  18. Lazer

    Lazer Senior Member
    Messages: 399

    Of course all the snow must remain on the property, I think that's pretty much standard anywhere.

    A rear plow can push backwards, too. Not awfully well, but it'll put snow up on the grass.
     
  19. Chuck Smith

    Chuck Smith 2000 Club Member
    from NJ
    Messages: 2,317

    I guess I like to bring up the part about the snow staying on the property as often as I can, hoping as many people see it as possible. Every time I go out to plow, I pass at least 20 piles that some "plow jockey" pushed out into the street. In fact, the moron that plows the complex I live in does it too. He does it "worse" than most, because he pushes it out and across the street, after the roads are plowed. He makes no attempt to push it onto the curb either. You then have a pile to swerve around long after the curbline pile has melted. Although we all know that pushing into the street, or across it is a "no no", there's plenty of guys that need to learn this.

    ~Chuck
     
  20. Lazer

    Lazer Senior Member
    Messages: 399

    What REALLY drives me nuts is when the snow is all done and we can start at 11:00pm and have PLENTY of time to complete all plowing by daybreak. The streets are plowed (even black) and guys leave piles in the road.

    I scoop the Boss and put a pile right in the drivway/parking lot approach where the snow came from! They get a customer call in the morning like they should.

    I can see being a little messy in the middle of a snow storm or blizzard, but when you have the opportunity to a good job and you make all plowers look bad instead, be sure it's not on my route!