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Unimount MVP wing help needed.

Discussion in 'Western Plows Discussion' started by firefighter1406, Jan 9, 2014.

  1. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    Have a Unimount MVP rubber center flap on my 99 Ford Superduty. I have a intermittent problem that's been going on for about 3 years. Normally it wasn't an issues but a few times a year, but now it's every time I plow. The right wing some times acts like it has a mind of its own. Go to scoop and the right wing will return to the vee position like I pushed to button for it, but I didn't. It is always the right wing doing it. I can go to any position angled right, left straight but the right wing will not hold. Sometimes it doesn't go all the way back and other times it will go back and forth like there is nothing hooked to it and it's just flopping around. I have adjusted the relief valves, checked all the connections with nothing noted. Changed the fluid last week. Sometimes it sounds like the power relay is letting the pump run longer then it should and the other day after moving it the pump stayed running. I had to turn the controller off to get it to stop. I am frustrated and can't be having this do this every time I plow. I have tried my dad's controller but of course when I had it the problem wouldn't do it.


    Any suggestions?
     
  2. michdeere

    michdeere Member
    Messages: 87

    If it didn't act up when you used a different controller, maybe that's where the problem is? I have had to replace the circuit board in 2 of my hand held controllers.
     
  3. mishnick

    mishnick 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,243

    First, if the pump continued to run and then stopped when you shut off the controller then that was caused by the controller, it was not a sticky relay. And second, as said above, if the problem doesn't happen when you used your dad's controller then the problem is probably in the other controller.
     
  4. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    It kills me because the controller is only 3 yrs old. Not sure if my dad's controller was the fix. I am gonna have to swap with him for a while and see how it goes. But I really want to figure it out. I wish there was a better way to figure it out because those controllers aren't cheap!! I guess I need to look into a new controller though, because it does engage the motor longer then it should quite often and if the controller is the only thing that would cause that I guess that's the deal. I have the older relay wiring. Can I use the never style flex fleet controllers? I saw something about 2 wire isolation something. I have the 10 pin round connector, I was thinking about going with the round to square adaptor and get the newer style controller. Will that work?
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2014
  5. mishnick

    mishnick 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,243

    U r condemned to the controller style u have with that big black plug. Fleet flex controllers r not an option. It would b a $1000 to convert. Easier to buy a new plow than to upgrade. In some cases I know the wires break and some people replace parts in them. I know they r about $400 here.
    U could upgrade to isolation module but that only really involves the lights. U would still need the same controller.
    My advice... Buy a controller and leave the rest alone. Just fix what's broke.
     
  6. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    Thank you Mishnick for your advice so far. The black plug really doesn't bother me. What bothers me is the fact that a $400 controller only lasts 3 yrs. That motor running only happened once that I know of. But it worries me that I wouldn't be able to hear it running while plowing (diesel truck plus radio) and could burn up my pump. So you say controller. Is there any valves or coils that could be going crazy causing the problems also?

    I just don't want to be throwing money at it. I am sure your the same way.
     
  7. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    Will any controller with the 10 pin round plug work? Fisher or Western. I found a fisher controller with the round plug but it says "flex fleet". Will it still work?

    Got my last one new on eBay for $200. Not a single one on eBay right now and the dealer wants $435!!!
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2014
  8. mishnick

    mishnick 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,243

    Fleet flex and yours differ in this way. Your plow has 6 valves and 6 wires that go all the way from the plow to the controller, plus a few more for ground, power etc. fleet flex has only four wires regardless of the number of valves. Two are for power and ground. The other two are communication wires. One carries commands to the plow while the other sends diagnostic info from plow to controle. With fleet flex all commands are sent down a single wire as different frequencies and then decoded on the plow.
    That fisher controle may have the same plug but if it is really a fleet flex there will only b four wires in it. It won't work and might get damaged by plugging it into your system.
    It is possible that u have valve problems but the way to eliminate the controller is to swap it out. If the other controller makes the plow work right it's the controller. If your dad has the same plow try your controller on his. If the problem occurs on his plow that confirms the controller as the cause.
    The 3 year thing may have something to do with how u use it. Do you jam it between the seats? Do you let it drop and sit on the floor? Do you remove it and store it in s cool dry place over summer or stuff it in the packed glove box and leave your truck parked in the sun all summer? The controller is a delicate piece of electronics. Pretend it's your cell phone and your next one might last longer. I know people who have had one controller since they bought their plow almost ten years ago. Then there r some controllers that had inferior components right from day one. I know that there have been recalls on controllers because of broken wire problems.
    Seems odd that you have had this controller for only three years when the MVP was discontinued about 5 years ago. Was it a used unit when you bought it or brand new?
     
  9. Western1

    Western1 Senior Member
    from MI.
    Messages: 677

    It's amazing to me how some controllers are maintained or lack there of!
     
  10. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    Thank you for explaining the flex fleet stuff. I take care of my controller. Always put back on the holder on the dash. I do store it in the garage in my plow box. So I guess it does get exposed to moisture changes and heat changes. The plow was used and came with the old 6 button control with the mode switch for scoop and vee. So when I bought the plow three years ago I bought this controller for ease of operation. According to westerns parts diagrams the 6 button and the 10 button controllers that I have use the same wire harness. I might try swapping that to see if I have a broken wire in the controller wires. My dad is coming to my house today. I will swap controllers with him and try plowing some. And see what happens.


    It's just weird with the pump running until I power off the controller saying that the controller bad. On the other hand the wing going crazy could be a valve problem. Weird.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2014
  11. Western1

    Western1 Senior Member
    from MI.
    Messages: 677

    It could also be in the controller cord that is replaceable by itself.
     
  12. michdeere

    michdeere Member
    Messages: 87

    Western1 is right, you can replace just the cord. You can also replace just the circuit board inside the controller. That's what I've done. IIRC the board was under $200.
     
  13. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    I was told the circuit board was not available anymore. Guess I need to look into that better. I just wish there was a magic tester that you could plug in and it would tell you what you needed to replace.
     
  14. mishnick

    mishnick 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,243

    "It's just weird with the pump running until I power off the controller saying that the controller bad. On the other hand the wing going crazy could be a valve problem. Weird. "

    Not so weird, consider the operation of the relay. It's just a magnetic coil that pulls a copper disk against two lugs. When the controller allows power to flow through the coil it becomes magnetized and closes the contacts. These relays go bad and often stick in the closed position. Most of the time when this happens you can turn everything off and the motor still runs.... until you pull the plug at the grill. That's when you know it's the relay. In your case the fact that when you shut off the controller the pump stops indicates that the controller is continuing to send power through the relay even after you release the button. No failure on the part of the relay, it's just doing what the controller is asking.

    And since we have established the controller as being "unreliable" I would bet that the erratic operation of the wings is the controller too. Don't start pulling valves until you try a new / different controller. If it's sending bad commands to the relay chances are it's sending bad commands to the valve coils too.

    As far as getting new cables and circuit boards go I would ask myself if I am good with a soldering iron before spending money on parts. If they are still available at all they are not a plug and play thing. Not positive about this but I think you have to unsolder and re-solder the fine wires. It's not easy for a novice, you need to be good at soldering or you could easily overheat the circuit board and melt the glue that holds the copper foil onto the fiber board. Then you will be out money again. Buying new cable and circuit board only to buy a new controller in the end is not something you want to do. Only try the repair if you are competent with electronic repairs. A new controller is a sure thing.
     
  15. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    I really do appreciate your input on this. You have been very helpful. I guess I will look around and see if I can find a new controller at a reasonable price and go that way. Half of me wishes it was doing it all the time that way I would feel justified buying the new controller. I tried to get it to do it today with no luck.

    Wish me happy hunting for a good deal on a controller.
     
  16. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    Out of total off the wall curiousness what would I have to change wire wise to get the 4 pin controller. Since that is obviously the way things are going. And I am sure they are going to stop supplying the 10 pin controller at some time. My dad has an extra 4 port isolation module I am sure I could con out of him :)
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2014
  17. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    If anybody sees a 10 pin western mvp or fisher ezv please let me know. Thx
     
  18. firefighter1406

    firefighter1406 Senior Member
    Messages: 328

    Well I swapped controllers with my dad a couple days ago. Haven't had any snow but told him to work the plow ever time he gets a chance. He called me tonight and said that his plow went haywire earlier in the day and was doing the exact same thing my plow does. So as glad as I am that I think we figured out the problem. Spending $425 on a controller plus tax makes me want to cry. Between the new cutting edges, controller and a new snow blower this year is flirting as a bust!!!
     
  19. mishnick

    mishnick 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,243

    I feel for you.... The first year I bought my Wide-out I paid over $8000, installed it myself and only invoiced about $5000 all winter. But this year has been a god-send. My plow is paid for and we invoiced over $5K for December alone! The good times come and go, just hold on, there will be more white gold falling from heaven soon enough.
     
  20. Antlerart06

    Antlerart06 PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,437

    Things must sell high up there I couldnt see paying 8k for a plow for a truck