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Trying liquid salt for the first time.....

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by Brian Young, Dec 3, 2008.

  1. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    After many, many headaches with using bulk salt I finally made the decision to try salt brine. I'm just going with a gravity feed system for now just to see how it does and I like it. I sat down and talked with the guy who has done this for years and he was an honest down to earth guy who didn't try to tell me that salt brine is the end all be all for ice control which was nice to hear. (some one who didn't try to sell me something just to sell it). I know there was a lot of chatter on here about liquids and like usual the post either turned into something else or deleted, so PLEASE try to stay on the topic!. I will go step by step to make it easier to understand and the results. I am BY NO MEANS ANY EXPERT ON THIS SUBJECT but I'm just tired of trying to read these specific posts and they get hijacked with a bunch of useless comments. Here goes......I'm just using a 275 gallon skid tank, I am running from the tank a flexible (cool looking ,lol) 2" hose down to a Banjo manual shut of valve assembly into a 1 1/2" spreader bar. I drilled 1/4" holes every 4" in the bar. I might drill larger holes if need be but for now I'll try this set up. The brine has a 25% sodium chloride ratio. He said its good til' around -18F. There is a ton of stuff to know about using liquids so if you have a specific question PM me. We're supposed to get another blast of winter Thursday, Fri, Sat into Sunday. Hopefully I remember my camera! I just hope this helps some guys out, kind of a step by step. More to come soon.
  2. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    BTW Here are the prices I paid for everything so far

    275 gal Skid tank $150.00

    Material hose $2.80/ft (roughly 8ft)

    2 Quick disconnect coupler assembly's $22.00 ea.

    Manual shut off valve $45.00

    Schedule 80 pvc 1 1/2" spreader bar and fittings and one "T" around $35.00

    So far just under 300.00
  3. JD657757

    JD657757 Junior Member
    Messages: 15

    I bought one of metro melts units it works pretty good but still need some salt. I also wet the salt with it.
  4. L70

    L70 Junior Member
    Messages: 25

    Good thread, keep it coming
    I am planning the same thing, What mix are you using? Are you making your own
    brine? I would like to know how to do that
  5. elite1msmith

    elite1msmith 2000 Club Member
    from chicago
    Messages: 2,762

    brain , i tried the gravity feed system this summer, as an experiment.. if you want some more tips on it let me know
  6. timberseal

    timberseal Senior Member
    from 46385
    Messages: 247

    How many gallons a minute do you think you need to be able to put down? It's basically just salt water isn't it?
  7. dannyslawn

    dannyslawn Senior Member
    Messages: 106

    Are you using straight sodium chloride brine solutin? I thought salt wasn't very effective below 15 degrees F.
  8. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    Absolutly! Its going all together today, just in time for a nice clipper system to move through.
  9. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    The mix is 75% salt brine and 25% chloride (thats what he told me)
  10. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    Definetley still need rock salt! I found a hitch adaptor that has two, 2" receiver tubes, I'm running the spreader bar with a 2" male end in one of the holes and I'm running a small tailgate spreader in the other one. That will give me the set up I wanted.
  11. elite1msmith

    elite1msmith 2000 Club Member
    from chicago
    Messages: 2,762

    brain , here is what i learned. I have posted this before, ill do it one more time

    Keep in mind this was all tested with water, and gravity , i truely dont knwo how it would preform with a thicker liquid like brine

    4-6 inch spacing on the drilled holes.... on a sprayer with pressure, I know afew ppl say go with 10 inch spacing, but i found on gravity , since the "stream" really isnt a stream, it needs to be closer so 4-6 sounds good and looked correct to me

    add the size of your holes up. if your drilling 1/4 inch holes, every 4 inches 8 feet wide -
    32 holes X .25 = 8 inches id say your hole size is a little on the large size inorder to make sure that you get a consitant flow the holes must regulate how much comes out, not the boom size or the feed hose. So in this case you would need a combination of 8 inch hose (way big) if not you will be starving some of the holes for liquid and the stream will be more of a drip.

    you should feed the boom in at least 2-3 locations, feeding a center tee only.... until the boom completely fills you will have uneven spray due to gravity , keep in mind your truck doesnt sit level 100% . now that would only work if your boom was that size (8 inches in yoru case) you can feed it with mulitple hoses, as long as they all add to 8 inches. so a center tee, plus 2 fitiing on each end = 3 total feeds. if each feed is 2.5 inch hose, x 3 - 7.5 rounding thats close enought to 8 inches....

    depending on how you place the feeds to the boom , and their size, you could skip on the 8 inch pipe and go way smaller. but it still needs that 8 inch feed to keep it flowing

    the larger boom and hose you use, as well as the distance between the shut off valve and the boom , will determine how much will come out after you shut the system off. For me, i have heavy traffic lots,were i have to stop and go alot... even if i had the electronic valve , i figured that i would be wasting at least 1.5 gals each time i had to stop .... so i added the cost , and this is were i stopped the project and moved to a pressurized side of things
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2008
  12. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    Thanks elite! Heres what happend so far.....I drilled 3/16 holes every 4" apart. I didnt put the Banjo valve on yet, I just bought a gently used Fisher 1000 ( I still want to run rock salt) I am going to mount the larger Banjo valve on the rear of the spreader this weekend. We ran the hose directly from the tank down to the boom for now. We did a test run and holy crap it came out like I had a pressure system, I can easily run at 10mph and get great coverage. My boom is 88" wide total and so far so good with the flow. We're getting snow right now but I want to plow first then see how it does after plowing. I dont know if it comes out so well just because the tank is full but tonight I'll find out. I hope I can maintain the same flow all night.
  13. elite1msmith

    elite1msmith 2000 Club Member
    from chicago
    Messages: 2,762

    my set up is gonna be a magnum tailgate, plus the 9 foot boom spray , all electric let me know what you think of yours
  14. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    Hey guys, here are some results I had from my first time out with liquid. Sorry if this is jumbled, I've been up since midnight. Sorry no pics yet, but I think we can all get the jist of it. Here goes......The temp. was in the mid twenty's, we got about 2" of snow. I did learn you cant burn off snow as well as I thought you might be able to. I spread it on about 1 inch that was packed down and you could hear it popping under the ice but that was about it. When I came back about 20 minutes later it didnt do so hot. Second thing I learned, I need a electric shut off valve. I didnt hook up the manual valve yet (waiting for Fisher 1000 spreader) so I had to hustle to the bed and jump in and turn the valve off at the tank every time, (that sucked!!!!!!) and not safe. Right after the lot I was plowing was done I spread the liquid with great results! It even burned off the packed down tire tracks. Within minutes after applying the lots were wet, without any trace of snow or ice at all. I'm not sure of the rate of application but all I know is it pours out through the 3/16 holes and I could drive around 7-10 mph and still lay it down effectively. After we were done it snowed again about an inch or so and the places that we saturated with the liquid did get covered with the new snow but was bare again minutes after. One thing I did was just hang the spreader bar with yellow poly rope 14" from the bottom of my bumper. It looks ok and moves when I bumped a pile of snow while backing up, if it were mounted to something solid, I think it would stand a better chance of breaking. All in all I like it so far, it does a great job in the right conditions, its a lot cheaper than rock salt and there is no lifting. Once I get my electric valve, just flip a switch. One thing I definitely noticed....even the 275 gallon tank moved my truck back and forth while driving. I felt like I was on a ship,lol. Using the second tank tonight and a Dramamin pill for sea sickness,lol. The mix I was told is Salt Brine, Calcium Chloride, Potassium and some Magnesium mixed in.
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2008
  15. elite1msmith

    elite1msmith 2000 Club Member
    from chicago
    Messages: 2,762

    brain, the main reason that i didnt keep going with gravity , is the electric valve for like 2 inch plus hose is some big bucks... and there is still the waste factor after shutting the system off, if you need to stop due to traffic. just so you know, iv been too busy, but my pressurized system is almost done, i just need to get a tank
  16. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    I hear ya about the price. The guy who sold me all of this other stuff will sell me a Banjo unit for 200.00. I dont think I'm going to spend the money right now, between buying a 2700.00 Downeaster that I'm not even using (its for sale), and then buying this set up, then a used Fisher 1000 for 400.00 I have about 4k wrapped up in ice control. My Wife would BEAT me if I spent another 200 bucks,lol. Plus if I like it the liquid this much I will look seriously into a pressure system for a 1 ton set up with a sidewalk hose system as well. I think when I mount the good manual shut off tomorrow, I'm going to mount it as close to the spreader bar as I can and to the left of the unit so all I have to do is come around the rear of the truck and there it is. I'll try tomorrow to get some pics. I'll be in a warm shop.
  17. elite1msmith

    elite1msmith 2000 Club Member
    from chicago
    Messages: 2,762

    why dont you try buying a long peace of threaded rod.... take off your tail gate,. and have the handle by the rear window...
  18. baddboygeorge

    baddboygeorge Senior Member
    Messages: 237

    brine recipe???

    whats that secret formula???
  19. Spaulding425

    Spaulding425 Junior Member
    Messages: 1

    Sodium Chloride

    Hello Mr.Young!
    I'm new to this site and was wondering if you could help me out with this liquid spreading!
    I have info about it but really don't understand the reading for NaCl 23% liquid. , Solid
    Gal/LM lb/LM
    22 50
    Temperature Range 30-32
  20. JeepPlow18

    JeepPlow18 Senior Member
    Messages: 658

    SHHHHH..... its a secret:rolleyes: