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Truck mounted snow blower!?

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by Schuley, Jan 7, 2010.

  1. Schuley

    Schuley Senior Member
    Messages: 156

  2. lumps

    lumps Senior Member
    Messages: 365

    Looks like a cool idea, would be nice for resi's. They didn't show it taking more than half width at a time though.
     
  3. Schuley

    Schuley Senior Member
    Messages: 156

    lol there's another thread about it already I see....someone beat me to it!
     
  4. BDEMOTT

    BDEMOTT Senior Member
    Messages: 117

    this is my cousins but i got the chance to take it out to clean up some of my accounts. With lake affect snow so prevelant in my area this thing is great for residential driveways that drift all over. They have had it for about 10 years and its held up well.

    IMAGE_034.jpg
     
  5. yardsmith

    yardsmith Senior Member
    Messages: 248

    saw those in northern tool over 12 yrs ago-always wanted to try one out.....
     
  6. wideout

    wideout Senior Member
    from iowa
    Messages: 727

    $8500 and slow as s**** no thank you but it is cool to watch
     
  7. PTSolutions

    PTSolutions PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,533

    would be really nice if a company would make one that could run off of fords new live pto hydraulic system if it had enough flow and pressure. hear that pronovost...
     
  8. WIPensFan

    WIPensFan PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,468

    Can you lift it off the ground as high as a plow to drive around town?
     
  9. BDEMOTT

    BDEMOTT Senior Member
    Messages: 117

    it lifts it about a foot or more off the ground.
     
  10. pohouse

    pohouse Senior Member
    Messages: 322

    In the video for the lots they were doing, I could move more snow quicker with a blade. Looks slow and loud. It's all about what is most time efficient IMO. I'm sure there are certain circumstances where this would be better than a blade or pusher. Clearing piles maybe. I wonder, is it worth the price?
     
  11. Triple L

    Triple L PlowSite Fanatic
    from Canada
    Messages: 5,965

    now that would be really cool!
     
  12. leon

    leon Senior Member
    Messages: 872

    Pronovost PXPL snow blowers

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The PXPL allows you to clean and blow snow at the same time and drag and blow snow to get rid of it in one pass as well as pull snow away from dead ends and carry it back blowing it in front of the blower while the tractor is reversing which allows you to place the snow where you want it gone the first time.

    The scraper blades are metal or softer plastic to allow scraping with out damaging pavers, asphault, concrete etc.

    The operators cabin of the tractor being above the blower gives you a wide clear view of the blower and the area in front of the blower.


    leon
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2010
  13. leon

    leon Senior Member
    Messages: 872

    pronovost PXPL snow blower

    The hydraulic power versus the PTO drawbar power would be a non starter as the blower weight would make the truck nose dive. You would need a vane type hysdraulic pump with a hundred gallon reservoir to feed fluid power energy to radial piston hydraulic motor delivering the rated horse power using one to two inch ID hydraulic lines to deliver the equivalent energy with fluid power of a 65-105 horsepower diesel tractor.

    Any noise generated comes from the scraping of the auger and blade and the actual movement of snow through the auger to the impeller and out through the chute. .


    leontymusicussmileyflag:waving::drinkup:
     
  14. doubleedge

    doubleedge Member
    from ND
    Messages: 64

    That seems excessive.

    With a truck mounted snowblower, it would be easy to get from account to account and it can be mounted onto a vehicle that most contractors already have. Not everybody has a 65+ hp tractor sitting around.
     
  15. leon

    leon Senior Member
    Messages: 872

    pronovost PXPL snow blowers

    ===============================================================

    Its the age old question of opportunity cost which
    includes "what is my time worth?

    1.What make more economic sense when making a
    purchase like this?

    I can buy a tractor attachment to do three jobs,
    plow, scrape, blow snow which allows me to do three jobs at one time and may have a higher first cost and obtain two pieces of machinery that are very well built that
    require some maintenance and are designed to last thousands of operating hours and
    will always be economical to operate and maintain as they are less complicated to repair and obtain parts if needed and require a minimum stocking level of adequate spares for the blower being;

    spare roller chain for auger drive-exact length with master link
    spare hydraulic cylinders for spout elevation and rotation
    hydraulic hose spares if desired
    spare Impeller paddle for the specific blower
    spare PTO shaft with slip clutch-complete-including PTO shaft guards and chain keepers for universal joint covers
    shear pins,
    wear edges
    gear oil
    A gear box spare with vent could be part of the desired spares inventory or in any case the option of ordering for next day delivery exists if the authorised dealer does not have one in stock.
    skid wear shoes/plates for the auger frame housing,
    spare cutting edge

    A modern tractor requires maintenance and will last for many years if properly maintained
    by the owner or service department of the dealer. A used tractor can also be obtained at a lower first cost and the ownership cost is less and if it has been well maintained all the better.

    A tractor and snow blower willl give the end user the ability to handle large snows every year and smaller snow fall at a lower annual fixed cost of ownership.
    ================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================


    A simple basic plow or a v plow of some type and a truck used to plow requires maintenance including insurance and registrating the vehicle in the municipality. a plow truck is subject to wear and tear will require tires and suspension parts to be replaced due to shock loading additional wear and frame damage if it occurs, the plow truck will need to be properly maintained like an auto mobile and will reqauire suspension parts due to excess wear from more travel and loading from a plows weight.

    A truck frame of anhy size will be subject to additional stress from the additional weldments for the plow hoist frame and be subject to broken welds more quickly.


    A plow trucks electrical system will be under greater loading from the oil pump and brighter work lights as well.

    a plow truck will require more braking power due to the extra weight of the plow and simple physics which will require longer stopping distances/greater separation between vehicles for safetys sake and reaction time maybe slowed due to driver fatigue due to stop and go traffic.



    The snow blower requires a tractor of adequate power to operate
    the snow blower.

    The tractor is considered a farm use vehicle only by most municipalities
    and is a slow moving vehicle requiring an SMV sign and a beacon
    while used on the road.

    The tractor is heavier vehicle with a heavy drive train and large engine and ag
    or turf tires and snow chains. the tractor travels slower than a truck but with a cabin
    it is comfortable to work in and reduces operator fatigue.

    The travel time is slower and a plow route would frequire leaving earlier to do it if it
    is of some distance.

    The snow blower is in the rear of the machine allowing the operator full frontal vision of the area in front of the tractor and full vision in the rear due to wide open glass and a higher seat.

    A modern tractor seat is designed to be very compfortable and reduce operator fatigue by offering more support to the operators spine and hips reducing discomfort from long hours of operating at very low speeds doing ground work.


    This also allows a job like snow blowing to go quickly and reduce fatigue from driving as the operator in in a very comfortable seat.

    The operation of the snolw blower at 540 rpm requires a high narrow power band with any tractor.
    I do not remember if they are offered in a 1000 rpm unit. The PTO shaft delivers the rated needed RPM to the blower gear box that is required to operate the cross auger and the impeller fan at required RPM.

    A tractor is nothing more than a two wheel or four wheel drive mobile power delivery method to operate a mounted attachment or to deliver motive power to ground engaging attachements like a plow, rototiller, disc harrow, or a PTO powered combine, a PTO powered ground engaging harvester like a sugar beet harvester, potato harvester or a towed implement using PTO power such as a hay baler or towed forage harvester.

    A plow truck can be looked at the same way as it is using motive power to rotate the wheels and push a snow plow blade to cast away snow fall.

    The plow truck can push snow at a faster rate of speed which can limit the operators line of sight and total; visibility from snow being shoved around if it is powder snow.


    The snow blower will not windrow any snow unless it has be piled to be removed on the next pass if the disposal area is not within reach of the discharge spouts throwing distance

    The snow blower allows one to control the snow it is removing by containing it in a narrow area such as directly in front of the auger to dispose of it at the end of the pass by simply lowering the chute and pointing at the area of pavement in front of the snow blower cross auger.

    Dealing with wind and blowing snow while using a snowblower can be problematic just as it would be with a plow but the tractor is slower and the operator is up higher in the tractor cabin to see over the blower due to the tractor cabs height and lighting above the snow blower.

    The blower could be used as a straight blade plow and the snow could be blown away and removed entirely if desired where a plow requires stacking room if and only if it is available.


    The scraper allows you to pull snow away from areas where it is built up and the tractor can access the area to drag the snow away to dispose of it safely avoiding any possible impact damage from ice and snow accumulations.


    The snow blower will allow you to contain the snow in front of the blower while backing up and blowing snow so it stays in one place until you have an open area to dispose of it.

    A plow is limited to where one can direct the snow and how much it can push without being stopped by the physical weight of the snow it is trying to move due to its mass or a pile left previously that could also be frozen.


    A truck plow frame is subject to breakage of welds as well as increased cutting edge wear while traveling at a faster plowing speed,

    The plow pump may be subject to failure for various reasons being pump age, lack of care, moisture in oil, defective soleniods, high amperage wiring damage from heavy use, wet or burned wiring shorting out the pump electrical system..


    The snow blower has three attachment points on the tractor used to power the attachment being the upper adjustable link(being either hydraulic or non hydraulic operated and the left and right lower links which operate in tandem. The blower is attached to the power take off of the tractor and an accessory light cable for the spout is desired to proved more light for the directional spout.

    The operation of the snow chute is hydraulic allowing 360 degree rotation and return to zero degrees and high or low angle of discharge to control the direction of snow while traveling forward and in reverse.


    I believe a slip clutch enabled PTO shaft is available and it will protect the blower and the tractor from any overload damage if that possibility exists.

    The snow blower impeller fan drive train is protected by shear pins and I believe the roller roller chains to power the auger rotation have shear pins as well.

    The snow blowers hydraulic system is protected by the relief circuit of the three double acting rear accessory hydraulic lines required and used for the chute rotation and the scraper blade.

    The snow blower is raised and lowered using the tractors three point hitch hydraulic system which is independent of the three accessory circuits used to power the scraper and chute controls as well as the chute rotation.

    The Opportunity Cost is always "what am I willing to give up to obtain something else of equal or greater value in return?
    A heavier piece of machinery that I may not need every year but will always have in reserve for any massive snow fall that may occur and the piece of mind knowing I have a piece of machinery that I know is well built and will last with regular maintenance. The ability to do specialised additional snow removal work such as loading snow in dump trucks quickly with an extended chute option for minicipal and mall clean ups when the opportunity presents itself- that is not possible with a plow truck. the abilty to remove snow the first time without leaving snow banks and providing bare surface with available down pressure from the tractors. hydraulic system.
    Is it worth the ability to nearly eliminate snow shoveling in smaller spaces like cul de sacs where a truck plow can not enter and turn easily to remove snow easily and reduce snow build up hazards in the process with out additional machinery because of smaller areas and an architects desire to follow form rather than function when the cul de sac or development was designed? down the road from me is the perfect example where a housing common exists with clustered small homes following the example of the tightly placed african village where your neighborhood is compact and everything is shared with a eating area and laundry set up and roads that are so small it is difficult to manuever fire trucks let alone a plow truck- it cost them a number of incomplete houses that were torched and burned to the ground and could not be saved due to the design and close spacing of the homes and the narrow access road.


    the penny wise and pound foolish discussion have no relevance simply due to a piece of equipments longevity where buying more power costs less to own as it requires less
    effort to do the work as the machine has more useable power and can operate at a
    a much less frantic pace than a smaller engined piece of machinery where less engine loading
    required due to the larger engines cubic inch displacement and the machines weight and mass. The snow blower has the abilty to totally remove any snow away from where it is being removed and it will not be touched again as it is physically blown out of the way and gone.

    A decision tree is warranted to examine something of this nature as all the variables are considered.





    A few things to ponder on a saturday in the frozen eastern wilderness at 1140 feet above mean sea level.


    :waving::sleeping:
     
  16. leon

    leon Senior Member
    Messages: 872

    truck mounted snow blowers

    The only way any improvement will occur with these machines is if the design includes a belt driven flywheel impeller but it becomes an issue of weight and space and patent infringement .
    The current design works and continues to work and is compromise between speed and ease of use and efficiency.
     
  17. leon

    leon Senior Member
    Messages: 872

    snow blower

    fixed my typo :^)
     
  18. theonlybull

    theonlybull Senior Member
    Messages: 405

    i'd have to dissagree with you on this. i have a couple systems in use at the moment, that are rates as 80hp systems, using varriable dissplacement pistons pumps, gear motors, and a 100 gallon tank.

    this is an engineered system, it only requires 70 gallons of oil, but was upped to 100 for service factor ( this is an inside installation) if it was a mobile system, it would have required 35-40 gallons. or slightly less and a cooler.

    if your operating a blower rated at 540 rpm imput, then you don't need a radial piston pump. actually, they like higher rpm, and will be lacking torque at the lower rpm ( depends on the curve of the motor)

    still not gonna work on a one ton with a pto on the tranny...

    the ones that are mounted on a truck use smaller augers, and smaller second stage. this makes it slower going, but uses less power...

    i you want to plow, and blow with a truck...... buy a unimog. wesport
     
  19. leon

    leon Senior Member
    Messages: 872

    truck mounted snow blower et. al.

    The Staffa and KYB radial piston motors I dealt with were rated for very high rpm for clutch pack drives and wheel drive motors using a reduction chain drive for mining machinery etc and were fed with a pair of 65 gallon vane pumps running at 1300 rpm. not that its worth pursuing.


    Buying the small Mercedes Unimog 400 here is about $160,000 tags and tax new sans options and the Schmidt blowers-non drum type were much more expensive than a pronovost PXPL 75-85 of comparable size and were designed to cut ice banks primarliy.

    The Beilhack giant snow pumps are an animal all thier own as they can move up to 22,000 tons per hour with the SB 1600 model in rail service using snow cutters and sweep boards to shave additional right of way width on both side of the track centerline however. and can be mounted on the smaller unimogs and do require slow operation in heavy snow pack.

    potato, potatoe, lets call the whole thing a wash and dance the hokey pokey before the hockey game as snoopy and woodstock always do. :waving:
     
  20. ConnorExum

    ConnorExum Senior Member
    Messages: 282

    If you want a snow blower truck look for a Sicard or Oshkosh.... They make the best. An older Walter wouldn't be bad, they had one with a KTA 600 on the back that was a real pig in the snow.