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Tractor vs truck time ?

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by Marek, Feb 17, 2013.

  1. Marek

    Marek Senior Member
    Messages: 270

    Looking at adding a few large tractors . The current owner has 12' plows on them . I feel a 12 - 14' box would be faster in larger lots . How would you compare thier speed and efficancy to a truck with a 9' plow ? Its rare for us to get a large snow so here it wouldnt be for power.
     
  2. Antlerart06

    Antlerart06 PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,437

    I have a 11' Coats w/side boards on a 7740 4wd Ford tractor most time it dont get used until we get 6'' + snow
    Trucks are so much faster going to each place uder 6''
    If snow 6'' plus The tractor can move lots of snow short period of time but is little slower going to each job but makes it up on the job
     
  3. Marek

    Marek Senior Member
    Messages: 270

    these would all stay with in 2 miles of each other on large and med size commercial lots
     
  4. viper881

    viper881 Senior Member
    Messages: 459

    How long are the pushes? Are you mech. inclined with tractors incase of a break down of some kind. Really depends on the parking lots, 12ft pushs more snow then a 9 ft blade. But a truck can reverse quicker. I guess you have to compare pricing if your buying new or used if you have to buy blades for a truck or a pusher for some tractors.
     
  5. Marek

    Marek Senior Member
    Messages: 270

    These are units we are looking at and they currently run 12'ers on them and we will charge the Brickman rate of 285 an hr for them . Both are over 110 hp . Pushes are 400 - 700 ft each
     
  6. IMAGE

    IMAGE Sponsor
    Messages: 1,741

    Anything with a 12' pusher is going to outwork a truck with a 9' blade, that's a no brainer. Go for it and enjoy having more productive equipment!
     
  7. Marek

    Marek Senior Member
    Messages: 270

    Its only productive equipment if we get snow and we are under 2" this season and 2 "last for our plow area. But we have had nine salt events this year which is a big help but it just eats up the trucks
     
  8. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    Not sure what tractors your driving but all of mine will back up faster then you have the balls to drive them. A 100 pto hp late model farm tractor will at minimum will plow double a pickup in basically any condition. Keep adding snow and longer pushes and that goes up 3-4 times. If all if your work is within 2 miles its a no brainer.
     
  9. CDC8002

    CDC8002 Junior Member
    Messages: 13

    We run a 160 HP Case IH Puma at a large Dairy Plant with a 12' pusher. Last year we ran a N.H.555 TLB. Wasn't sure in the beginning of the season if it was a good idea but my operator doesn't want the Backhoe back. He has shaved a Hour and a half off his plow time with a 6" snow fall. Only down fall is pushing up piles. Has plenty enough hydralic power just that the loader arms aren't made heavy enough for busting into hard heavy snow piles. Have seen guys bend the **** out of them. We bring the loader or backhoe for that part of the job when needed.
    We also have a Kubota 42 HP tractor with a 10' pusher. The thing will push a full box plus. We put a plate on it and my partner runs it all over town plowing. He wants to buy anouther one because it's so much faster than his F350 with a 8.5" Fisher V. His route is about 5 miles. It's as fast backing up as a pickup and visability is much better.
     
  10. hatefulmechanic

    hatefulmechanic Senior Member
    Messages: 228

    You must be talking about an old Ford 3000, cause everything on the market now, even 10 years old, is typically a shuttle shift that goes the same speed forward that it does in reverse.

    Not much scarier than backing one up at 23mph :eek:
     
  11. dfd9

    dfd9 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,475

    Listen to this guy, he knows what he is talking aboot for once.

    I have a truck with an Ebling 16' and Blizzard 8611LP and a JD 5101 with a 16' Ebling and standard 8611. So basically the same setup.

    The tractor will outplow the truck day in and day out, with me running the truck, and I have just a little bit of experience. The tractor will double the productivity of the truck, with the exact same plow setup.

    And if you're backing up that much, you're doing something wrong. Because you're losing money with the plows up in the air.
     
  12. Marek

    Marek Senior Member
    Messages: 270

    Would you tractor guys run a 12 or 14 ' on a 140 hp tractor ? Units have loaders but I lean more towards frame mounted boxes. Loader arms are to expensive to mess up
     
  13. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    What they weigh is more important and what kind and size of loader. I also talk Pto hp. We've been running 14 ft pushers on 2 JD 746 loaders for 9 years and havn't bent them but they're are heavy loaders. The tractors weigh I'm guessing 16,000 lbs plus. A 12,000 lb tractor will have trouble pushing a 14ft pusher in some conditions. Also 12ft will fit almost anywhere and be able to work on its own where we always run a 12ft with our 14's so they can get the narrow spots.
     
  14. Antlerart06

    Antlerart06 PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,437

    One thing with a tractor You can zero turn it and plow the other way if parking lot setup right

    I have rear hydro blade. I can swing it to one side and as I back up I can windrow as I'm backing up

    Bad thing about a tractor its to comfortable . I stay awake better in a truck vs tractor
     
  15. DodgeRam1985

    DodgeRam1985 Member
    from Ohio
    Messages: 82

    I don't think you can really go wrong with adding a tractor to your arsenal. I would however suggest a couple of things.

    First, is this tractor going to be devoted solely to snow removal? If so, your horsepower range is going to be ok. But if you are thinking of expanding it's use out some, consider something slightly bigger in the 160-180hp range. Trust me, you will only be mad and dissapointed when you go to run something and your hydraulics aren't adequate or your simply need more hp's.

    Second, you are dead on accurate when you talk about loader arms not taking much abuse, if you use them to ram snow banks, or pound down with the bucket, you surely are going to bend or break them (although chances are you are going to blow a hydro line or fitting first). My suggestion is to bypass the manufacturer's loader system, and instead work with a local machine shop (preferably one that specializes in agricultural equipment) and have one fabricated. All of my loaders (JD4250 and JD8200) have been custom built. Not only is the steel of higher quality, they are also heavily built. Now I still have had them bent and busted, but far less times then the guys running JD's loader system. The main down side to this method though, is that you lose any of the quick attach systems that JD has out right now. This can be overcome, but basically in my situation I needed the loader only, I didn't need bale forks or anything like that.
     
  16. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    I'm sorry but the new style JD loaders, Aloe loaders and CNH loader will make any machine shop loaders look like a joke. You'd need you head checked to go backwards I time. The 746 and 846 John Deere loaders are basically indestructible. Now if you go back 20 years some if what you say may be true. Basically all new loaders come with global quick tach and that is what you want as most blade manufacturers are producing that mount. I've plowed commercially with farm loaders for 24 years and my dad did 16 years before that so we have a pretty good idea of what works as we've ran basically every kind of farm loader made plus many shop built ones.
     
  17. DodgeRam1985

    DodgeRam1985 Member
    from Ohio
    Messages: 82

    JD Dave, I don't disagree with you completely. I'm a diehard JD guy, always have been and always will be and JD in general has made huge advancements in their loaders, and the quick tach is amazing, if you have the need for it and put other ends on your loader besides a bucket. My biggest gripe with the loaders isn't really even the loader arms. I think those are pretty well built now, at least from what I've seen sitting out at the "money drain" (aka dealership). My biggest complaint with their loader systems is their buckets. I personally just don't think they are built all that well, now I'm not saying they are terrible, but for my money, I know I can have a bucket fabricated that will exceed my expectations greatly. My tractors are also used to row crop here, and I'm not sure but in my area we farm rock with a dash of soil, so there is a lot of digging and prying on rocks to get them up and out of the ground and hauled to the rock pile. Just been my experience that I've cracked a lot of welds on JD buckets, but haven't done so on either of my custom made buckets. Just my opinion and experience, like I said I won't disagree with you that they are much better built now, but my experience dictates going to a fab shop like Unverferth or Hill Bros and having one made (although i don't think either of those shops make buckets anymore, mostly just wagons and tillage equipment).
     
  18. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    All our buckets are Horst or Aloe. I will agree with you on the JD buckets not being superior. We have a lot of stones and do a lot of digging. We have a European made 9 ft stone fork and it is near indestructible for picking and digging stones. If they are extremely big we did them out first with a bucket then we have use a Horst stone fork grapple to pick and sift the dirt. We have 5 loaders including our JD telehandler and 3 of them have hydraulic quick tach which is extremely nice.
     
  19. 2COR517

    2COR517 PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,115

    Listen to JD Dave.

    I spent 8 hours after Nemo in a 71 horse Mahindra with a regular dirt bucket. I keep telling him to put a box on it. The increased productivity would more than make up for the 23 mph travel speed.
     
  20. milkie62

    milkie62 Senior Member
    from Troy,NY
    Messages: 231

    I have been toying with the idea of bidding the lot where I work after I retire in 2 yrs.I found out that the bid is $130k.My buddy was going to work it with me.Right now the contractors use 4 pickup trucks,but are here forever.There are 4 employee lots that would take about 1 to 1.5 hrs each with a pickup---I did one once so I know.Then there is the tractor trailer area which is 30 overhead doors plus roadway and another 30 car lot.Was going to get a line on 2 -- 125-150 HP tractors with loaders and 12' box blades and 8' rear blades along with maybe 2 pickups.Then if I got the bid make my purchase and hope for snow.