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Spinoff: decals on your truck, need to have DOT numbers, and hauling racecars...

Discussion in 'Business Fundamentals' started by trqjnky, Feb 29, 2012.

  1. trqjnky

    trqjnky Senior Member
    Messages: 620

    alright, im getting my truck decals made for my auto shop and for my snow company. i figure now im going to have to increase my plate to the 10 ton weight rating or whatever it is. and get DOT numbers im sure since i haul a LOT of cars for my shop on a trailer.

    Now, my question is, if i get my DOT numbers, and put them on my truck as a decal on the doors, if im towing my off road buggy or racecar, am i ok to do that since its not for work?
  2. grandview

    grandview PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 14,609

    Gray area,your not really using it for work,more for recreation. You ready don't see personal trucks with DOT numbers hauling campers.
  3. dfd9

    dfd9 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,475

    DOT rules do not apply for smaller trucks when it is being used as a personal vehicle. No worries.
  4. trqjnky

    trqjnky Senior Member
    Messages: 620

    well what if i use it for work and snow removal so i need the dot numbers. but also use it to haul my personal toys?
  5. dfd9

    dfd9 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,475

    You won't be doing that at the same time, right?

    If you're using it for personal use, it is no longer a commercial vehicle, because it isn't being used to make money.
  6. trqjnky

    trqjnky Senior Member
    Messages: 620

    but im not taking all my decals off.
  7. dfd9

    dfd9 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,475

    Never said you were.

    It doesn't matter if you have decals, if it is not being used to make money, it is NOT a commercial vehicle.
  8. jomama45

    jomama45 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,172

    This is where it get's tricky. What if he's racing within a sactioned body and receiving a pay-out??? :popcorn:
  9. South Seneca

    South Seneca Senior Member
    Messages: 473

    I have yet to see a race car make a profit. He who puts the most money into the car wins!
  10. Bandit

    Bandit Senior Member
    Messages: 146

    On other forums I read where the state police were hanging out at the race tracks on Fri. and sat. nites and handing out tickets , You are racing for a Trophy ,? that has a value , COMMERCIAL USE .

    Pa. View on the subject

    I asked a question of two different Federal Officers …What if a person is a member of a
    car club and the club obtains money from sponsors, the car is required to run the decals of the sponsors. The prize money for anyone who wins is made up partly of the money the club obtained from sponsors and partly from membership dues. Now, is that considered corporate sponsorship? BOTH of the agents I spoke with told me no, that would be prize money and the exception would still apply if they claimed it as regular income and did not write off expenses as part of a business. The difference is Corporate Sponsorship is what is paid to an individual whether they win a race or not, endorsement money is based on a driver winning and is therefore PRIZE money.

    Part of the problem appears to be how the officer stopping you interprets what he/she is seeing. And, how do you, as the one being ticketed and potentially impounded, prove to the officer that you are simply a HOBBY racer and not in business or under a corporate sponsorship?

    Taken from here
  11. Bandit

    Bandit Senior Member
    Messages: 146

    It looks like if You have Decals on Your racer , some officers are calling that sponsorship ?
  12. Rat_Power_78

    Rat_Power_78 Senior Member
    Messages: 175

    Had a friend get stopped hauling a truck to a mud race and the cop claimed he could potentially be making money. Guess it depends on what kind of mood the cop is in and how bad the state needs money.

    To get back to the issue, what sort of truck are you using? 3/4 ton? Or bigger? What is the GVW of the truck and the combination? Are you crossing state lines? My guess would be you have to have a DOT number and be able to supply that number when stopped unless you are crossing state lines. Of course, depending on the answer to my questions above, I could be way off.

    On a side note, are you planning on getting annual inspection done on the truck? If so, you may have to get the trailer inspected also.
  13. trqjnky

    trqjnky Senior Member
    Messages: 620

    i do cross state lines. if i cross state lines, i DONT have to display numbers?

    i would get both truck and trailer inspected.
    3/4 ton dodge diesel, tandem axle tilt bed car trailer with 7k axles on it. haul everything from quads to diesel trucks.
  14. Rat_Power_78

    Rat_Power_78 Senior Member
    Messages: 175

    Sorry if I was unclear. If you cross state lines you will need to display DOT numbers. Minnesota just started requiring numbers displayed Intrastate as well so you may want to check. A DOT official giving a talk on the laws told me you are better to put it on because as long as everything else apperars legal, you will most likely not get pulled over.

    I very much understand why you are lettering up your truck, but you may want to consider magnets so you can remove them. My trucks are all lettered and inspected, both to be legal and for the advertising value. IMO, for plowing you want that exposure, brings in more business, right? The downside is you very likely be hassled more by the DOT since you are considered "commercial" and are very clearly showing that fact.

    Add to this the fun new law enacted Jan 3rd of this year to "fix" distracted driving problems and lettering up a truck starts to look real bad to me...


    I believe your combination would be considered a CMV and therefore, affected by this rule. However, it appears to me that a guy with a truck and trailer (no logo) would not be a CMV as far as the law is concerned. All this makes magnetic signs look more appealing to me. Just something to consider.

    I know people that have been hassled in 3/4 ton Dodge diesels (myself included) just because there is a logo on the side, so make sure lettering up your truck is what you want to/need to do. I hate to pay for something only to throw it out later. My dad always says "Its easier to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission" so maybe run without logos until you have to?

    Sorry if I dragged this out to far but I tend to research the crap out of any decision I make and I was in nearly the same situation not long ago. Hope this helps.
  15. trqjnky

    trqjnky Senior Member
    Messages: 620

    well, i should have a street named after me, or at least a ditch for my donation to the state of iowa.

    525 dollar later. got my dot numbers, bmc number, and ucr. GAY! i had to get "for hire" dot numbers because i haul customers cars and charge for them.
  16. Rat_Power_78

    Rat_Power_78 Senior Member
    Messages: 175

    Yup gotta love Government Donations
  17. cretebaby

    cretebaby PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 4,162

    ;) ...............
  18. skimastr105

    skimastr105 Member
    Messages: 35

    you don't have to make a profit to be considered engaged in commerce... you just have to be accepting money of any amount. I could haul your race car across the country, or re-landscape the entire track for a dollar... certainly I wouldn't be making any profit, but I would still be considered a commercial vehicle because I am using it as a means of receiving money.
  19. 90plow

    90plow Senior Member
    Messages: 734

    couldnt you just say you were doing it as a favor?? Are the cops going to check your tax returns and write offs to see if your getting paid to haul a civilian vehicle not even a piece of equipment. Seems over kill to me but they arent that strict in NJ.
  20. ryde307

    ryde307 PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,132

    You have a weird situation. With you using your truck and getting paid hauling customer cars then yes it would need all the #'s.
    If you just had a truck or RV to goto races you dont need this and this is why you seee most dedicated haulers saying NOT FOR HIRE on the side. Also allows them to get past weigh stations and such.
    Either way its BS. You have people who sit behind a desk making laws they have no clue about. yet if I am joe blow homeowner I can tow my 40ft camper trailer behind my f150, or goto a landscape yard and put 3 tons of rock on my snowmobile trailer and all is good.