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ontario general liability insurance cost per 1000?

Discussion in 'Business Fundamentals' started by Luke_P, Dec 14, 2010.

  1. I know not everyone is rated like this but my general liability policy is priced on a given amount per thousand. $32.53 for excavating (seems reasonable) and $90.2 for snow(seemed high) checked my records and 2008/09 was 28.53 for excavating a 14% increase my snow went from 71.46 to 90.2 in the same time frame thats a 26% increase and 9% of my bottom line. what are other southern ontario guys paying thats a 2 million general per occurrence, up to 5 million total two and a half occurences I guess?
  2. anyone? someone one on here must have a similar policy?

    the numbers per thousand is for every thousand in sales i do they want x amount ie 10 000 in snow $900 in insurance at my new rate 10 000 in excavating would cost me 325 for insurance anyone else gone up this much? sorry if my last post was confusing
  3. gotsnow?

    gotsnow? Senior Member
    Messages: 257

    What company is your insurance through?
  4. gotsnow?

    gotsnow? Senior Member
    Messages: 257

    What insurance company is your insurance through?
  5. B&E snowplowing

    B&E snowplowing Senior Member
    Messages: 159

    I am from Barrie, My General Comerical Liability is 2 million on a per occurance basis. I do SNOW ONLY, and had one hell of a time finding a company. My broker finnaly found one, but I had to move my commercial auto, personal auto, and home insurance over to them as well. I was actually surprised my commercial auto dropped by 250.00 per year, my home dropped by 110.00 per year, my personal auto went up by 93.00 per year and my general liability DROPPED by 125.00 per year. WOW what a savings... I now pay 1200.00 per year for General Commercial Liability Insurance with 2 million liability, on a per occurance basis.

    I am with Wawanesa Insurance.
  6. capitalsnow

    capitalsnow Member
    Messages: 65

    Im with wawanesa for my personal insurance, bussiness insurance is through
    Dubé, Cooke, Pedicelli Inc, both very good companies
  7. greywynd

    greywynd PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,339

    I'm just going through this now myself, I've had excavating insurance for a couple years, and want to add the coverage for snow. First price I got was $5000/year, with projected receipts of $10K or less!!!
  8. sorry guys didn't see all the responses.

    my broker is schofield aker in oshawa. the company providing the coverage is intact insurance fromally ing direct.

    a policy for two trucks a 7 ton dump trailer and a 2007 honda 4 wheeler runs me about 4 k a year for full coverage replacement value on the plows, salter and the new truck. the old 1996 is covered for more then book value (around 20k i think). 4 wheeler and trailer are owned so they only have liability. I dont think that rate is to bad.

    my general liability for excavating costs me 32.53 per k so at 15k reciepts they ding me $488 for snow its $90 per k on another 15 so they hit me $ 1353 for snow. I had to claim higher numbers for excavating then i really do because of the inurance companies reluctance to insure snow only companies. I am looking at greatly expanding my snow next year(mostly resi's with a tractor cheaper rates then commercial maybe?) and i don't know if they will want to cover me or not. anyone else do snow only or a much bigger proportion of snow to something else?
  9. bump...................
  10. greywynd

    greywynd PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,339

    Luke, what kind of excavating are you doing? I'm finding that there are 3 'groups' of insurance out there, excavating, landscaping, and snow. Most of the companies only want snow if it is a small portion of your excavating or landscaping. Most will not do snow only, or as a major portion of your work, as you are finding.

    I have found one company that won't cover excavating, but will gladly cover landscaping and snow, and have several current policies that are about 50/50 on the amounts of work they do. As I'm looking at changing the focus of my work, I may go with that, as about 50-75% of my excavating is actually landscaping anyway.

    It's hard to find a 'one size fits all' solution as so many of us have different needs for insurance. Expect to spend lots of time on the phone, networking and so on. I'm also going to keep an eye out and the upcoming landscaping show for other possible insurance companies to deal with as well.
  11. grywind thanks for the reply.

    My excavating is mostly rural farm land work with a backhoe (580sk in pretty good shape). Mostly trenching, fenceline removal, stumps, rockpiles, small lot clearing, basement excavating for water proofing, pretty rough work but pretty low risk. I pick up a lot of work the bigger guys don't want to do. it began because we bought the hoe for our own needs and kept getting asked how much for this and that etc...

    unfortunately for me my business is opposite %70 snow and %30 excavating and land clearing. I realize insurance is hard to get and nothing fits everyone. I was on the phone for 2 days (literally on the phone for it) when i started this company a few years ago to get on with the company I am with for decent rates. the ins companies are real gunshy of start ups apparently which i can see if your a computer programmer buying a d-8 but i could prove related experience. I guess my biggest complaint is the large increase in snow from two years ago compared to the marginal increase in excavating.

    Just wondering if everyone else had similar increases or what? like you say all I can do is get on the phone after the holidays and start calling around for hard #'s. just wondering what others in my market are seeing.

    thanks in advance
  12. greywynd

    greywynd PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,339

    That sort of work is considered light excavating, it's similar to what I do. I think you're fortunate in your location, here I'm up against some of the small turned large guys, and it's gotten tough to find work this year. (When a company has 50-100 pcs of equipment, and the big stuff gets slow, they'll do the small stuff too.)

    I started out doing mini excavating, and I think I'll be refocusing to get back into more of that, and maybe adding property maintenance to the list as well. Having year round, or at least winter/summer contracts as a steady baseline is appealing, so I'm thinking about trying to setup a mix of the two.
  13. grywnd I live just south of you about thirty minutes. go to peterborough and lindsay a lot to friends farms, hunting, equipment sales etc. your right its hard up there a lot more guys still work for themselves. for instance the 8 farms that make the block around my parents one guy is still farming his own, one farms his own and rents 3, the other two are rented to two other guys. less people farming = less equipment and competition. most of those people make there living in the city and just live out here.

    I work a f\t job myself on shift work so i get a lot of days off. the snow suits me better because i don't do a lot in the winter so I really pursue snow work, which is why I do a lot more of it I guess. just chatting at this point but hey thats what a forum is right?
  14. ps i like the minis as well I had a nice little deere available to me as needed for clock hours only it was pretty sweet. not as strong as the hoe but got me into a lot of places and very versatile. also agreed about steady money as far as snow and maintenece goes its the only way to go in my books or maybe a 50\50 mix (contract vs per event) sure makes planning your business easier.
  15. greywynd

    greywynd PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,339

    Getting a bit off topic, but isn't that what forums are about? :D I might take a run down to Cobourg next week to meet up with Midtown and check out his Ebling setup, let me know what hours you're running, maybe we can join up for a small road trip and coffee or something if you're interested.
  16. JohnnyRoyale

    JohnnyRoyale 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,935

    Your snow price per thousand seems very high.
    Whats your claim history like?
    PM me for some insurance contacts if you like.
    I did some shopping this year and found some good savings.
  17. johny agreed it seemed high to me to. will pm u for sure just got a letter today that they doubled the premium on my second truck because i added a guy with no plowing experience he's plowed since he's 17 but having a hard time proving it. good times. oh yeah all drivers have a clean record and ive never had a claim against me for the liability policy.

    grywnd off mon tue and fri pm me if thats cool for you?
  18. JohnnyRoyale

    JohnnyRoyale 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,935

    Your insurance company sounds like a bunch of amatures. Ill send you some contacts on Monday.