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New 9.5 MPV giving grief

Discussion in 'Western Plows Discussion' started by topher, Dec 15, 2005.

  1. topher

    topher Junior Member
    Messages: 8

    I've been scanning the threads for an answer to the problem I,m having but am left to thinking I must just be the only guy lucky enough to be dealing with this. The plow and truck are brand new. A 9.5 MPV on a 2005 GMC 3500. In the scoop position the plow doesn't want to lift half of the time, which is just great when your trying to jam a blade full over a curb. I have plenty of theorys, but Im looking for someone who has had a similar problem and has found the solution. Here's the details. If I back off from the scoop position a bit I get my lift back. Most of the time. This tells me the pumps sucking air with the angle cylinders fully extended. So I get the dealer to top up the resevoir which does absolutly nothing. I would say for sure that the problem is the resevoir capacity exept for the fact that at times the blade won't lift in the straight position either. OK, mabey im getting air in the system some how. (did i mention this plow is brand new?) Another possibility is that the relief valve is backed of too far. The pump is apparantly the exact same one used for the 8.5 MPV as well. Their has to be at least a hundered pounds difference between the two. Yup. Im grasping at straws, but i find it hard to believe that Western would be dumb enough to make a resevoir thats to small to operate the plow properly. Unless of course someone tells me otherwise. Anyone? Thanks.
  2. OneBadDodge06

    OneBadDodge06 Senior Member
    from Iowa
    Messages: 731

    I have the 8'6" mvp. Are you waiting til you get up to the curb to lift? Is it heavy wet snow that your pushin? I've noticed with mine that its easier on the pump on the scoop position to start my lift about 3 seconds before I get to my pile and stacks good too. Now last night plowin slushy wet snow, it didn't want to lift the plow til I stopped backed out a little then lifted. I don't think there's anything wrong with the resevior since they are both the same hydro setup.
  3. Playboy

    Playboy Senior Member
    Messages: 335

    I don't have an answer but I would suggest the dealer check the voltage going to the pump. I haven't had any issues with my MVP but as you said I have the 8'.6 so you're dealer with more weight then I am. Have you checked in the manual for trouble shooting tips?
  4. Crash935

    Crash935 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,377

    Pump relief pressure is set to low, should be set a 1750 + or - 50 psi, being that its on an 05 truck it should still be under warranty, take it back to a western dealer and have them test it unless your comfortable with hydralics and have a 3000 psi gauge, if so, then go to westerns site under publications, you will find a troubleshooting guide for the ultra V that will tell you how to check the pump relief.
  5. topher

    topher Junior Member
    Messages: 8

    Thanks for the replies. The relief pressure is sounding like a good bet. From previous experience with dealers in general, I'm going to wait until Im sure I know what the problem is. There's nothing worse than taking the time to get things fixed by the proper people and having to do it over and over and over again. Im not totaly convinced that air is not some how getting in the system. This is why. The blade will lift about 1/3 of the way and the pump changes pitch and all stops. No, im not still in the snow bank, and I've acutally gotten out of the truck to see if its loaded up with snow, which it's not. Here's the funny/frustrating thing. If I drop the blade an inch or two (not to the ground) and lift it up again I usually get my full cylinder travel again. To me its almost like this action somehow purges the air from the system. Please keep in mind I didn't start plowing snow for the first time in my life yesterday. I fully understant that I can't expect the plow to lift with 300 extra pounds of snow on the blade. This is a mechanical/hydraulic problem, not a nucklehead operator (although i did back into one of my own trucks a few years back). I'm hoping to give the dealer a solid idea of what the problem is before I have to drop the truck off and pick it up five times. I appreciate your help so far. I'd also have to say that this 9.5MPV doesn't stop for a whole lot. Nice to see with the foot of snow we got last friday.
  6. Jt13speed

    Jt13speed Senior Member
    Messages: 366

    Topher, i have a friend thats name is topher to, thats pretty cool, but anyways...you got any pics of that truck...we'd love to see it.
  7. Crash935

    Crash935 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,377

    Since you are leaning towards an "air in system" type problem, i would have the dealer pull the tank and check to make sure the pick up tubes and return tubes and screens are in place.

    Not to bash your dealer and since i dont know the size of them, but i sounds like they are just trying to pick at things, ask if they have copies of the mechanics guides or print a copy and use it to explain what your talking about and see if you get a reaction from him.

    But i doesnt hurt to have them pressure check it also since it only takes a few minutes.
  8. topher

    topher Junior Member
    Messages: 8

    I'm thinking its about time to visit my dealer. Although air in the system seems to answer alot of the problems, i kind of doubt it to be a problem on a brand new plow. That post by mm?? brought to light the fact that 50lbs (weight of two wings?) can push the relief valve over the top. That could answer alot of the problems and would make more sense given that the pumps come from the factory with the same settings for the 8.5 and the 9.5 MPVs. You would think that the factory would set things up for the plow thier being used for, but maybe thats the dealers bad. To his defence, I understand this unit is a new set up for 2005 so maybe he's not quite up on his reading. I just wonder who's going to pay for all the fillings that have rattled out of my teeth when i catch the last inch of those blasted curbs! Ouch. I'll see if i can get a picture of the truck on here when I figure out how. Later.
  9. orenlasko

    orenlasko Senior Member
    Messages: 142

    sounds familiar...

    i have a new truck, and the same new plow, and the same problem. there is no air in my cylinders at all, and western tech support suggested overfilling the reservoir, and that has made a little bit of difference. i am going back next week to have the pressure checked. Where did you buy from? where are u located...

  10. topher

    topher Junior Member
    Messages: 8

    Hey hey hey. I finally brought the truck to the dealer and had them tweek the pressure relief up a bit. I now have a new plow that actually operates like one. You would think that Western would make sure the hydraulic systems are set up for the plow there sold with, or at least make an effort to keep the dealers informed of any changes nessesary. Its a good thing the plow kicks butt or I might be kind of mad. So there you go, if you've got a new 9.5 MPV that doesn't get full lift in scoop position, don't fall for the "overfill the resevoir" solution. Have them jack up the relief pressure to compensate for the extra weight. This service advise has been brought to you by topher the tool man wailer. Thanks for the help.
  11. fortydegnorth

    fortydegnorth Senior Member
    Messages: 219

    I just installed my new 9.5 MVP and it seems to lift in the scoop position but the right wing wants to fade back about seven inches when I first put it into scoop. I am assuming I may have a similar relief setting problem since it goes up to scoop fine and then fades back immediately after the pump stops. I will have it checked on Monday. To top it off its mounted on a brand new F-350 dump that just set me back over 40K and it has an oil leak with 87 miles on the odometer. If it weren't for bad luck I wouldn't have any luck at all! Still love the Fords and Powerstrokes.
  12. Crash935

    Crash935 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,377


    Glad you got that thing figured out. As for western checking the pressure relief, its set like an old carb. Remember the turn it all the way in and then back out so many turns will get you close and then fine tune it from there? Same thing with a pump, but they dont pressure check every pump on the line so you may of had one that needed that fine tuning and since a quarter turn will get you 250 psi more it doesnt take much to be off.
  13. fortydegnorth

    fortydegnorth Senior Member
    Messages: 219

    I got the manual out and printed off some specs from the western site today regarding the settings of pressure relief valves for my 9.5 MVP and what a shock. Every setting was off, not just a quarter turn but in most cases nearly a full turn or more. The secondary on the left wing was not even a quarter turn open. No wonder the performance was poor. I had to take the truck in for the warranty work today so no test yet but it looks promising considering how far off everything was. Seems very easy to fix the problem but I'm having a hard time accepting that the pump would be shipped that way.
  14. fortydegnorth

    fortydegnorth Senior Member
    Messages: 219

    Believe it or not still haven't got the truck back from the second dealership that has worked on it in the last 8 days. And yes it only has 150 miles on it. I did have a chance to check the plow between the time I "limped" the truck home from the first dealer and it being towed to the next dealer. The plow is considerably better but the right wing still fades back about 2" after being put into the scoop position. I almost think the breather on the pump isn't alowing air into the resevoir and the vacuum is pulling it back. I only think that because while filling the resevoir and running the plow up and down and then re-checking fluid level the drain plug would blow out of the hole when I removed it from air being trapped behind it. If it compressed the air it probably creates a vacuum going the opposite direction and draws the wings back prior to the solenoid shutting. What do you think?
  15. Ultraclassic99

    Ultraclassic99 Junior Member
    Messages: 2

    Howdy,I have a 8.5 MVP with the drivers side wing not holding on a the back drag. She holds in scoop and retract. If I straighten out to back drag she fades out to a reversed drivers side V. Think my pressure reliefs are out... Any thoughts.
    All dealers in my area dumb-asses
  16. 01lariat

    01lariat Member
    Messages: 96

    I think a new set of valves all the way around for my MVP is in order. Mine doesn't hold postion to well either side or any direction. Let me ask though, can a person tweak the old ones himself? I don't know much about them. If so where would you find the info to do it properly if the could?. I had a uni-mount straight blade for many years and never had an issue of not holding position.
  17. Ultraclassic99

    Ultraclassic99 Junior Member
    Messages: 2

    MVP Ultramount Back drag hold gone

    Do you thing that the relief valves weaken?
    I have the service manual for this unit that I downloaded from Western but there is no breakdown image of Relief valves. I set the relief valves to 3700 psi ( 1 1/4) turns and still no hold. I will order new relief valves just to see