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mvp problems

Discussion in 'Western Plows Discussion' started by POWERSTROKE 350, Feb 4, 2009.

  1. POWERSTROKE 350

    POWERSTROKE 350 Junior Member
    Messages: 29

    my wings will not stay extended. if i am angled to the left the right wing keeps coming back when pushing snow, not failing, but the pump pulls it in. also when the plow is up and i am in wing mode and trying to set up the angle from v or scoop the right wings and sometimes the left when i put either one up, the pump will pull it all the way back in. i cycle it a few times and it will usually stay, but this is just getting very annoying. why are my wings acting up so much? Fluid? i have atf in it right now. bad seals, but like i said it isnt failing it is the pump pulling the plow back in. i am at a loss right now please help.
     
  2. jjmcnace

    jjmcnace Member
    from Iowa
    Messages: 64

    If it was my plow I would never use ATF in it. Just spend a few extra $ and get the Western Plow oil.
     
  3. Mebes

    Mebes Senior Member
    Messages: 411

    Took this from the 2005 MVP mechanics guide.
    Read this PDF and see if you can identify your problem.
     

    Attached Files:

    • MVP.pdf
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  4. POWERSTROKE 350

    POWERSTROKE 350 Junior Member
    Messages: 29

    that kind of helps but not really if you know what im saying. say i extend the right wing. it will do what i tell it to do, but following doing that it will then retract. i have the hand held control, could it be that? also if i push and it catches a little bump the wing that is out will sometimes retract a bit, i know if you hit something hard it supposed to do this to avoid damage, but even a little pressure, normal plowing it will do this. could i just need to go through the pump, i know the plow is at least an 02, so 7 years old and it came with the truck when i bought it. judging from the shape the plow was in the kid before did not take care of it. one wing was bent, so something was hit pretty hard. this past summer i took everything apart to sandblast and paint and straight and fix the damage he had done, but i didnt go through the pump. i am not scared to go through it if need be, i am just trying to avoid it if i can. dont really want to take it apart during the winter with snow coming who knows when. thanks for all the help guys
     
  5. POWERSTROKE 350

    POWERSTROKE 350 Junior Member
    Messages: 29

    also, as said before i have atf in it, it sometimes moves a little on the slow side, though anything is faster than my last plow, an old cable comtrolled fisher, slower than molasses. would plow oil help? is it thinner than atf? also is there a screen in the fluid housing i could clean? i adjust the quill for drop speed and it is still the same speed, no change what so ever.
     
  6. Mebes

    Mebes Senior Member
    Messages: 411

    This sounds normal for the older hand held controller with the mode button.
    You hold the mode button down for a couple of seconds it starts to blink.
    The first time you press the button it retracts then next press it extends then press again it retracts again...alternating over and over again with every new press of the button.

    It operates just like the wing buttons on the new style controller, go to this Link It is for the Western demo of the new controller.
    The Mode button on the older hand held controller, when activated works exactly the same way as the bottom 2 "wing" buttons on the demo.
    Check it out and report back, if this is the problem.
    Or if this is not what you are talking about.


    This sounds like the relief is out of adjustment or dirty.
    Or you may have low fluid causing foamy oil.
    The air mixed in the oil in the piston will compress a little. (I doubt this is the problem, but you never know)
    Do you know if the fluid was changed annually by the previous owner?
    You may need to flush the whole system.
    I always use plow oil.
    It is thinner, and flows better (faster) at low temps.
    The blade responds slower and slower the colder it gets outside.
     
  7. Mebes

    Mebes Senior Member
    Messages: 411

    Yea there is a filter in there that should be changed.
    Plow oil is faster.
    Do you have the Unimount or the Ultramount system?
    My 04 MVP drop speed was not much faster even when it was new.
    When I adjusted the quill I could barely tell the difference.
     
  8. POWERSTROKE 350

    POWERSTROKE 350 Junior Member
    Messages: 29

    i know that is how the controller works, it retracts on its own after i let go of the button to to move it up. i hit the button the wing moves up, i let go of the button it stops then comes back on its own
     
  9. POWERSTROKE 350

    POWERSTROKE 350 Junior Member
    Messages: 29

    i have a unimount system
     
  10. Mebes

    Mebes Senior Member
    Messages: 411


    I think I am starting to understand the problem now.
    When you are plowing the wing starts to "drift" back on its own, and you have to keep hitting the button to keep it in it's desired position.
    Does this sound right?

    1. The pump is is not running.
    2. The blade retracts on its own. (when plowing)
    3. Will it do this when the plow is off the ground? (raised)
    Please confirm or deny these 3 points for me, they will help to decide if it is a bad control, check valve, or bad relief valve.
    S
     
  11. POWERSTROKE 350

    POWERSTROKE 350 Junior Member
    Messages: 29

    mebes, first of all thanks for all of your help.
    1) the pump is not running
    2) the blade does retract on its own
    3) sometimes it will do it when it is off of the ground i have notice, or even right away when i drop the plow and before starting a push.

    Also, when i put a wing up, while the plow is raised, it will retract on its own, and the pump will be running. i think there is two seperate issues at play here, but they could be connected.
     
  12. Mebes

    Mebes Senior Member
    Messages: 411

    Just to be clear on this...you put the blade in scoop first, and while the pump is raising the blade the wing retracts at the same time. Right
    This would probably be a sticky valve.

    The blade retracting on its own while you are plowing would be a relief problem.

    So yes it does sound like 2 different problems.
    Are these problems both happening on the same wing? (right side)
     
  13. POWERSTROKE 350

    POWERSTROKE 350 Junior Member
    Messages: 29

    you got it, the wing will also retract if the plow is angled left. the right wing will retarc. and yes it seems to be the right wing mostly, very rarely the left. how do i go about fixinf these problems?
     
  14. Mebes

    Mebes Senior Member
    Messages: 411

    I am looking at the hydraulic schematic, and I am scratching my head on the up makes the right wing retract part.

    Just to clarify when you said that when you angle left the right wing retracts.
    This is in straight blade mode, or is it in Wing mode (mode button blinking)

    Can you look at this PDF and see if your wire colors match the ones shown.
    Each coil will have a red wire attached to it as well.
    I am wondering if you have S2 and S3 wires switched.
     

    Attached Files:

  15. no lead

    no lead PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,308

    something sound odd for sure.check the wiring. try a different control? lift the plow and scoop it all the way. do both wings stay? try to push both back by hand. if one drifts back, you have an oring blown.
     
  16. Mebes

    Mebes Senior Member
    Messages: 411

    As far as the blade drifting back I am thinking PO check valve D is the likely suspect.

    I still can't figure a way that up.... would cause retract on the right piston.
    Is it possible that someone took apart the system and installed the wrong valve in the S3 position.

    S3 looks exactly the same as S2 and S5 but it performs a different function when activated.

    S3 should have the number SV08-43 stamped into the side of it (where you put the wrench on it)
    S2 and S5 should be stamped SV08-40

    You should probably check all three to see if they are in the correct positions.

    You might want to check this when you check the wires
     
  17. no lead

    no lead PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,308

    having the valves in wrong will definitely cause problems. good call mebes
     
  18. POWERSTROKE 350

    POWERSTROKE 350 Junior Member
    Messages: 29

    up does not make it go right. when it is already up and i put it in scoop or angle left, the right wing will then retract. it has nothing to do with the up button
     
  19. twinman326

    twinman326 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,683

    I might be a electrical problem in the harness, or a ground problem
     
  20. twinman326

    twinman326 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,683

    Powerstroke

    Look at this. It will tell you what valve. For example you want to angle right, or left,
    'motor is on", "S5" control both. Want to scoop "motor is on", and "S3,S4,and S6" are on. Now "S2" control the raise,angle left, left retract, and left extend. Maybe this will help, or maybe not.

    http://www.westernplows.com/pdf/21857_061503_web.pdf

    Also check the plow, and truck side harness. Foreign material in the plug can also cause the problem. Little moisture can create a electrical jump between two terminal. Or you might have to use a pair of pliers on the female plug(I believe truck side) and squeeze the terminals hole a little to make the prongs (male) go in a little tighter for better connection. Just make sure the plugs are clean. Use electrical spray to clean the garbage out. And make sure you use a good amount dielectric grease in the holes and on the prongs (that is a must).