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Magi Salt

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by PrimoSR, Mar 18, 2011.

  1. PrimoSR

    PrimoSR Senior Member
    Messages: 553

  2. JpLawn

    JpLawn Senior Member
    Messages: 208

    Do a search. There are plenty of threads about it.
     
  3. tuney443

    tuney443 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,847

    Been using it for years.What do you want to know?
     
  4. PrimoSR

    PrimoSR Senior Member
    Messages: 553

    Do you use the salt or the liquid? If you use the liquid how are you set up to spray it. Is it really that much more effective that regular salt? Financially from a cost/benefit basis how does it to compare to salt?

    Sorry lots of questions but I am very intrigued.
     
  5. PrimoSR

    PrimoSR Senior Member
    Messages: 553

    Thanks for the help! Where is the search button?
     
  6. PrimoSR

    PrimoSR Senior Member
    Messages: 553

  7. tuney443

    tuney443 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,847

    I only use Magic salt,it's good for app. -35*,the juice alone I believe will only work to about 20*,but don't quote me.It's much more effective than untreated salt by far.I pay $138.73 a yard,you only need app.1/2 as much Magic salt as untreated salt,but it will go to work immediately.Also,EPA approved,not harmful to concrete, metal,landscaping,and animals.After I plow my lots are black wet within an hour,much less if the sun is on them.
     
  8. PrimoSR

    PrimoSR Senior Member
    Messages: 553

    Are you a dealer?
     
  9. tuney443

    tuney443 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,847

    NO--if I was a dealer I wouldn't be guessing at the lowest temperature,nor would I be paying $138.73 a yard.I'm only a deiceologist[among other things].:)
     
  10. Mick76

    Mick76 2000 Club Member
    from Maine
    Messages: 2,157

    Tuney a few questions ..... I've thought about using magic in the past but I shy'd away from it........ I can get rock salt delivered for $74 a ton... even if I have to use twice as much as magic, it would still be close to the same cost as your paying (even if I were to spray my own pile, the cost would be pretty close) ..... I mean my lots that I use straight salt on are black after an hour also... Is there any "hidden" benefit for magic? I've heard it has better residual value then rock salt.... not sure if this is worth the 2x cost or not?...

    Salt is salt... how can magic "salt" be "safe" on the enviroment? I've just always wondered this and would probably be better to ask a dealer but I'll put it out there anyway)... I mean magic salt is just regular sodium choloride mixed with magic 0... its still salt...... I didn't know if you have any insite to these questions or not.....thanks
     
  11. snobgone

    snobgone Senior Member
    from CT
    Messages: 122

    The biggest benefit is the temperature operating range to -35 supposedly. When salt slows down and stops working, this stuff doesnt. There are many other products that do the same for much less, its personal preference and availabilty. Magic has everyones attention because its "envirnomentally safe" so for sensitive sites customers love it. Clear Lane, Ice Ban and other products work just as well and cost less.
     
  12. PrimoSR

    PrimoSR Senior Member
    Messages: 553

    I am wondering this too. Isn't the major ingredient salt? Does the Magic-0 change it is chemical composition? Or is it more environmentally friendly because you use 1/2 the amount and it sticks to its intended surface better?
     
  13. snobgone

    snobgone Senior Member
    from CT
    Messages: 122

    It claims to change the chemical composition of salt, and you can use less. It tracks better and a better residual than salt. The product works great. What would you want to use the liquid on? Would you be pre-treating? Its totally dependant on what your intended use would be.
     
  14. tuney443

    tuney443 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,847

    Mick--yes to the residual value for sure.If you have an inside storage area,you will be way less than the app. $140 a yard that I have to pay to my Magic distributor.At app. $3.00 or so a gallon X 8 gallons per yard,you'll be at $98 a yard if you get your own spray outfit.It won't even be that much more if your area dealer came by to spray your salt.By me,the more salt you have,the less per unit cost,as in anything in volume.

    As to being ''safe'',and EPA approved and all,here's my take---during a spreading of Magic salt,if the Magic juice on the salt melts the ice quickly and then the residual water evaporates, then it is considered safe.But if you're spreading it while it's raining and/ or you get a bad slushy Magic batch[caused by wet salt--Magic juice should only be applied to DRY salt],then the Mag chloride and the condensed distiller's solids separate away from the salt particles and your left with----salt,so then we all know the not so healthy aspects of that.
     
  15. tuney443

    tuney443 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,847

    It doesn't change the chemical composition of salt,the Magic O simply adds more punch to get quicker and much colder temperature results among other things.
     
  16. lilweeds

    lilweeds PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,178

    I can attest to the corrosion or lack there of when using magic. At the end of last year I had about two wheel barrels of salt left. I had two metal try ones that I wasn't using so I filled them with magic. When I used the salt this season there was not on spec of rust in there. As a matter of fact it looked better then when I loaded it. Can't say that for straight salt.
     
  17. Digger63

    Digger63 Member
    Messages: 44

    End Result

    It's always a balancing act when it comes to deicers, What melts the ice is the chemical heat ( not temperture ) that any deicer uses to break the bonds that are created when water turns to ice ( hydrogen atoms of water bond to each other ) . What helps keep them apart from reforming are the ions from whatever deicer you would use ( salt breaks down into one sodium ion and one chloride ion ) . Think of it as pieces of a puzzle going together and putting a marble between them The puzzle won't fit together = water won't turn to ice. All chlorides create heat that helps break the bonds that form ice. Unfortunately, they also accelerate rust and refreeze quickly once diluted. Organics used in deicers have a high ion content that keeps the water from bonding together to form ice ( the puzzle pieces and the marbles again) Okay, what does this all mean? If your looking for a fast melter at lower temps, go for the salt treated with more chemical, if speed isn't't an issue but refreeze and residue is, go towards the organic side. All liquid deicers have corrosion inhibitors either added of in case of the organics naturally in them, they all work by having a reduced oxygen content that helps keep rust from starting. Like I said with so many different products out there look up and try each to see what works best for you, Price, consistency, and knowledge of product is what you should look for
     
  18. tuney443

    tuney443 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,847

    Yeah,what I said.:) Not to shabby for a digger man.I might have to consult with my old chemistry teacher to see if that's on the up and up digger.:D
     
  19. T-MAN

    T-MAN PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,363

    Magic and other organic de-icers tend to be a pain in the butt to spray. The solid content is very high and they clog filters and tips very easily.
    Synthetic liquid additives are easier to work with when spraying, are more consistent, and dont fall out/ separate without re-circulation.
    If you intend to pre-treat or de-ice with straight magic-0 good luck making a profit in a competitive market. Unless of course u can purchase straight from the source (sears), eliminating the east coast magic markup mafia lol.

    Magic -0 treated salt does perform very well, but unfortunately it is mag chloride based/dependent. Without mag its still a distillery waste by product and useless. New research is showing mag chloride based products will be baned in more and more states sooner then later.

    On a side note- I still havnt figured out how a product can claim "as corrosive as water", yet it will wipe out aluminum faster then a pack of yotes on a deer carcass. How can that be ?
    Anyone ?
     
  20. Digger63

    Digger63 Member
    Messages: 44

    Spraying the organics really depends on the application. Most people spraying piles and mixing clogging isn't a problem. For my mixing I use teejet 8020 fan spray nozzles in my mixer and they clog only once in a while. I've found in the organics that there is a little sand grit that clogs once in a while. When I mix with salt brine for anti-icing application on roads using the teejet 8000 nozzles I've never had a clog.
    As for the advertising, you can spin things anyway you want and people will tend not to question and believe a good talker.
    Some places are starting to restrict mag chloride, the reason it is used is it's melting power and cost. At this point the switch may be to calcium chloride to boost the organics. Both mag and calcium are corrosive, both are usually mix with an inhibiter or the right degree of an organic. Each type of organic base (IceBite or Magic) I would assume would have a certain percentage of mix to inhibit corrosion.