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Is there an..........

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by DavidMetzger, Feb 21, 2002.

  1. DavidMetzger

    DavidMetzger Junior Member
    from idaho
    Messages: 2

    :( I there an easy way to figure out the application cost of deicer for a commercial job??????? Trying to secure this job for the landscape portion but he wants the deicer as well. Planning on using Magnesium Chloride to -10. but have been unable to come up with a suitable formula to figure the cost. PLEASE HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! this site has been great help in the past I am looking for a miracle now. To all that respond a big Thank You!!!!....

    PINEISLAND1 PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 664

    If you do a search on Deicing, specifically "application rates" you will see a lot of discussion on this the last three years.

    John Allin has pointed out studies done that show effective deicing at 250 lbs. per acre. Most seem to agree that between 250-600 lbs per acre are close to what they average.

    Around here, when I sub out my salting to guys who do large amounts of bulk salting, they typically run about 1000 lbs per acre. I think that is overkill, but when your charging by the amount put down, and the customer demands wet and black, I let them do it.

    Big difference here in applications, from worst case scenario to a light application, so coming up with an average for a bid would be tough.
  3. OriginalSnowman

    OriginalSnowman Junior Member
    Messages: 20

    I think calculating deicer applications is very site and storm specific. The amount of deicer you need to melt fluff in Idaho is less than we need to melt our classic New England bulletproof cement around here.

    How can you predict the weather? You can take a wild guess, but it is apt to be dangerous. If the customer has an ice storm and you have quoted on the basis of per application, and it takes 10 applications to get the ice knocked down, will they understand? Also, if it's a storm that falls warm over cold, will they understand that it took multiple applications to cut the hard pack that the trip edge just runs over?

    You can use a lot of estimates, but that's exactly what they are. Unless every storm is identical, it's going to be very tough because of moisture content, temperature, and duration.
  4. nsmilligan

    nsmilligan PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 704

    I use about 400#/acre of straight salt, and since I've switched to Magic Salt, I use about 250#/acre with better results. The hard pack the use to built up as traffic drove over the lots in between plowing is all but eliminated. I've had people ask owners what they were doing different this year. And the problem of the lot re-freezing as temps dropped, usually black ice, was reduced significantly!

  5. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,426

    You're right Tom, but the way the snow keeps falling this year, I've been getting real tired of the lot covered 10 min after its been plowed. So, we've been salting the heck out of our lots, also. And if you look at the way the county road commission has been doing it, that's why we've been putting more down. They put down just enough to melt what's there, anything else that accumulates turns it into a sheet of ice, so better safe than sorry.

    PINEISLAND1 PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 664

    Yeah, we haven't had the normal snowfalls , that is for sure. It has been tough keeping the commercials open all day during those 1"/hr days. I am very satisfied with the results of the salting, I just dont know how to cut rates and still insure wet and black. I know 450 lbs an acre works when you have time and temp on your side, but this year we kept getting into situations where we needed it to be gone NOW, and then keep melting it for most of the day. Either that, or we needed to send a truck out to babysit the lot all day and push the lanes continuously.

    It was a no brainer for me. My lots were white all winter from salt, and probably still are after last weekend!:D Customers are happy - and no slip and falls.