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Impact of beet juice mix

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by Italiano67, Feb 11, 2008.

  1. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 640

    What are the opinions of the impact the beet juice mix will have on private contractors if the county/cities start using it more? There are quite a few places experimenting with this and I dont know if it really is cheaper than straight salt use even though supposedly you use less salt overall. The cost of the mix seems high and I am sure the price will go up if everone starts using it. Just wanted to see what everyone thinks about it and I know some already use it mixed with your bulk salt to increase the effectiveness below 18 degrees.
     
  2. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    we are on our 4th year of using it now and i think it's great....in the past we have always pre mixed it before it was loaded into the v box. within the last month we have started prewetting it and so far so good....EVERYONE in our town uses it including the city. the supplier i buy form sells 1 million gallons per year.
     
  3. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 640

    I was thinking of doing the premixing of the Vbox loads too but want to weigh all options. Does it cost me more because I use less salt? Most customers are on a per hundred weight pay and I dont want to shoot myself in the foot. How much more are most willing to pay for the treated salt over regular? If it comes out even or slightly in my favor the extra labor might be worth it because of less trips to reload etc.
     
  4. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    the liquid cost about $3.25/gal...... when used for prewetting it is mixed with liquid sodium so it will flow through the tips better, and 6-8 gal are recomended. when premixed (use straight sugar beet) add 1 or 2 more gal. it makes for a hot mix and will continue to use it. EDIT: forgot to answer your ? when the temp is(or going to be) under 20 deg, i'll prewett the salt and it adds about $20 per ton. i guess i will pay whatever it takes to buy it.....BTW i am saving $$$ over my competition by prewetting, BC i have the option to use straight salt, whereas they all only store premixed.(either delivered bulk or delivered 1 ton bags)
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2008
  5. SteveR

    SteveR Senior Member
    Messages: 252

    Any links to teach me about this stuff..I just got my customers into salt two years ago. (not big spenders)
     
  6. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    not any links that i know of....i've done several searches over the past couple of years... i might be able to answer ?'s...PM me if you want.
     
  7. powerjoke

    powerjoke PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,341

    there are several chem's to use and i do not know much but i will twll you what i know........(it'll be short trust me :D)

    calcium chloride has a temp of ~-65* (verry corosive)

    mag chloride has a temp of ~-25*

    sugar beet has little to no affect on ice so i am going to guess ~+32*

    sodium chloride(salt) has a temp of ~-5*

    but the thing to remember is that when you have 10* ice, if you only applie salt there is only a 15* differ, witch will melt it but is a little slow (like forever)

    but there is a chem reaction when you blend 2 chem's ie. so if you take sodium (-5) and blend it with beet juice (32*) you get a much much colder freezing temp........i think around -15........but you mixed it with bulk salt


    now if you take mag and mix it with salt you get -40ish

    but if you take calcium with salt you get ~-70

    if you mix mag and calium (for corosivity reasons) and blend it with salt you get somewhere in the middle

    my number's may be skewed a little but for the most part they are correct


    p.s. the sugar in the beet juice is what makes it a good choice..........years ago there was a study that differ types of wine froze at differ temps which the only differ in the wine was alchohol content and sugar........ dry wine froze at a higher temp than a sweet wine i guess?

    hope this helps
     
  8. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    what's up PJ.......Gaylen is telling me that there is NO sugar in "sugar beet" all the sugar is extracted and used for "whatever" and the biproduct is what we have....
     
  9. powerjoke

    powerjoke PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,341

    i think the sugar is what makes it "active" and the dye in the beet juice is what makes it "mark it's teritory"

    p.s. have you ever talked to scottwood indistries yet i would be curious what he has to say to anwer youre q's
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2008
  10. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    haven't talked to him yet, i'm kinda getting burned out on snow plowing. i'll give you a call wed..... later