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i just don't get it

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by dayexco, Sep 22, 2010.

  1. dayexco

    dayexco Senior Member
    Messages: 312

    competitor friend of mine has been doing this lot for at least 10 years, did a wonderful job, some national took it over, this lot is about 4 1/4 acres total, plow, salt, sand, sidewalks...we average 17 occurances a year. last yr was 22. more or less told him to take $11,700 seasonal, or he was losing it. what's outlined in red, is what gets plowed. sounds like he's going to park some equipment. amazing

  2. snowman55

    snowman55 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,071

    look at it this way- the guys that got it are now busy making no money so it took them out the bidding on other work. the more guys who work for nationals the less lowballers I'm bidding against.They will learn then have an auction.
  3. hoskm01

    hoskm01 Senior Member
    from AZ
    Messages: 475

    Could it be that the Account Manager type people are bluffing on the price? They do work on "commission" style pay... the more their territory profits, the more they take home. Call their bluff. If they're wrong, take it back next year when the other guy runs out of chump change to cover his costs or quits mid-season.

    Does Ferandino and Sons have all the Shopko's? We don't have either here in AZ, but interesting tactics they're pulling. Whats your total annual average there?
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2010
  4. dayexco

    dayexco Senior Member
    Messages: 312

    no, he was told to take the $11,700, or he wasn't doing it.
  5. hoskm01

    hoskm01 Senior Member
    from AZ
    Messages: 475

    Right. Then they call next week and see if he'll take $XXX for the contract. Typical bluff situation. If they dont sound firm, even the suckers wont take the bait.
  6. theplowmeister

    theplowmeister 2000 Club Member
    from MA
    Messages: 2,513

    I keep hearing on hear that 1 acre will take 1 hour to plow, so 4 1/2 acres is 4 1/2 hours
    times 17 storms is 76.5 hours plowing getting $11,700 is $153/hour

    I thought $153 Hour is good for parking lots, no?
  7. WMHLC

    WMHLC Senior Member
    Messages: 248

    The price includes salt and sidewalks. Your price of $153 is just plowing. Depends on the amount of sidewalk, that price doesn't look to bad to me. If that was in my area it would go for around $9500 for everything.

  8. dayexco

    dayexco Senior Member
    Messages: 312

    sidewalks, loading docks, deicing, cart corrals, fire exits, fire hydrants
  9. bskiball

    bskiball Member
    Messages: 64

    I would plow for 153 hour... but they might want some salt put down a few times this season.
  10. forestfireguy

    forestfireguy PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,276

    Every one of the nationals/regionals I've ever dealt with or heard of has room in their numbers, we were offered a Target Store last year, 1st offer was 19K, I said sorry no interested, they cam back with 26K, I said get close to the 45 it should be and call me otherwise please save us both the time and me the cell minutes and find somebody else, they did. Low and behold 3rd year in a row they had problems. They still have the contract and will as long as they're saving the store money......
  11. cet

    cet PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,196

    Do you average 17 plowing events or 17 plowing and salting events.

    We usually plow around 22 times but salt 45. that place would be approx. $30K here.
  12. dayexco

    dayexco Senior Member
    Messages: 312

    we salt everytime we plow, except for late spring when temps are above freezing
  13. dayexco

    dayexco Senior Member
    Messages: 312

    i should add, there are a few occasions where you have a freeze thaw, or freezing rain to contend with, i would imagine an additional 8-10 times
  14. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 638

    Your dreaming. Do you think you are going to do that job without a loader to to stack etc? Also what about a skid steer to plow around cars and in tight spots. That type of figuring like you just did is exactly what got us into these crappy bids.
  15. CGM Inc.

    CGM Inc. PlowSite Veteran
    from Ontario
    Messages: 3,589

    Holy Crap!
  16. Brant'sLawnCare

    Brant'sLawnCare PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,748

    Seems like that should be closer to $20k. But I don't bid on much big stuff like that...
  17. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    A loader with a 12ft push box will average 2.5 acres an hour. So an average loader will get (around here) 90.00/hr which equals, 180.00. Then you will probably need a truck for an hour or so to get into small spaces, truck at say, $45.00(again around here). So just to plow it your at 225.00 x 20 events=4500.00 plus salt at 110/ton x say 25 salt events= 2750.00 totaling $7250.00. Around here that would be a good price.
  18. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 638

    What about the walks? Those always seem to be an item that gets thrown in the deal when in actuality is one of the more difficult items to keep on top of. also the salt price you quoted is very cheap.
  19. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 638

    Not to mention the time spent during open hours keeping lanes etc. clean. It never works out where you can go out and use those guesstimates on plow time. What about the all day events? Open 24 hours? The reason guys take these accounts and lose their hind end is because they dont take into consideration all of the details.
  20. ForestEdgeSnow

    ForestEdgeSnow Senior Member
    Messages: 136

    Not to mention all of the times you drive by a lot checking on it. Just to make sure that their is not snow on it. When you have a big box store your slip and fall incidents usually go up.