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hydrolic oil tank heater

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by Jay brown, Aug 31, 2008.

  1. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    our bigger spreader is run off of central hydro, and the v box is VERY slow running for the first 30-45 minutes, only when it's very cold. i usually let the box run while the truck is warming up till i start loading....we are using new AW fluid in it....i was thinking of putting a electric (110v) tank heater on the oil tank....anyone do this? you think it would help? BTW this truck stays in the unheated open shed..
     
  2. powerjoke

    powerjoke PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,341

    i don't think it ould hurt anything if you welded a bung in the tank and put a engine block heater element in it.

    have you tried synthetic fluid?

    are you sure that you dont have any other restriction somewhere else like a pluged filter or colapsed hydraulic suction hose etc?

    PJ
     
  3. Camden

    Camden PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 6,598

    I had the exact same problem on my 40' JLG cherry picker. It's got a 4 cylinder Ford engine that works great in the winter but it takes the hydraulics FOREVER to warm up.

    I spoke to a dealer about the problem and he suggested that I stick some magnetic oil pan heaters onto the reservoir and that's solved my problem. I put one on each side of the tank and I have them stuck into a multi-plug so I only have to run one cord.
     
  4. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    thanks, you just reminded me that i have one of the magnetic heaters in storage......
     
  5. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    I agree with PJ, some of our tractors have transmission heaters but as far as your truck needing one for the spreader, I don't think so. Have you changed the filter lately, how about your vent? Have any hydraulic couplers, they can restrict flow when cold. All the town and ciy trucks sit outside as well as mine sometimes and I have no problems after a few minutes have full speed. It doesn't even really get that cold where you are does it? How big is your oil tank, too big and it will take forever for your oil to warm up. Another trick if your salter is empty, is when you start your truck to warm up, turn your PTO on and your salter, that will warm your oil up. High speed road travel will make your oil thicker due to wind chill. IMO I think somethings wrong somewhere. Sorry for the ramble.
     
  6. B&B

    B&B PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 12,777

    Common misconception there JD, wind chill only has an affect on warm bodied creatures.

    The only effect wind chill has on inanimate objects (such as oil) is to shorten the amount of time for the object to cool. The inanimate object will not cool below the actual air temperature no matter what. For example, if the temperature outside is -5 degrees Fahrenheit and the wind chill temperature is -31 degrees Fahrenheit, then your inanimate object (again such as oil) will not drop lower than -5 degrees Fahrenheit.
     
  7. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    Huh, I guess I'm wrong. For some reason when we have to road our loaders on the road, when it's very cold our loaders are very slow for the first couple of minutes, I guess it could be something else. Thanks for the information, I did not know that.
     
  8. B&B

    B&B PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 12,777

    That would be the likely cause...because of course the oil will thicken in lower temps, and that would be especially more noticeable at higher GPM's (like at road speed).

    But you Canadians should be used to that. :D
     
  9. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    Oh yeah, we only have one season here, Winter.:D
     
  10. hydro_37

    hydro_37 PlowSite Veteran
    from iowa
    Messages: 3,790

    I second the magnetic heater. It is easy and cheap to try too.
     
  11. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    I agree it's a great idea but he shouldn't need it, if the truck is set up properly. JMO
     
  12. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    the truck is a old MODOT state truck and and the spreader is also an old MODOT spreader. all the fittings were the same and they plugged right into each other.....only thing i had to change was the oil tank since i took the dump box off, the old L shape tank was in the way. the current tank is about 15 gallon and the big wix filter was new when the truck was fitted....

    100_0431.jpg
     
  13. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    only thing different now is that the truck is red of course.....o, also last year i think i was the only person to every buy a Salt Dogg pre-wet system????... the controller still doesn't work properly, so before you spend $3400 PM me and maybe i can give you tips.
     
  14. cet

    cet PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,202

    Can you tell me the manufacturer of those rear fenders? Thanks.
     
  15. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    Truck looks good Jay. That tank has the proper vent and is the right size. I was just giving you some idea's to look at. I would change the filter, just to see, we change ours every year anyway. I reread your post and I see you let it run while your trucks warming up, so that's good. How open is your chute? We have found that running our chute wider takes less oil and then we can run our spinners faster. This might help when it's colder for you.
     
  16. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    Call multi-lift they sell them.
     
  17. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    the fenders have been great so far... only thing i have left to have done to it is put a locker on the rear end and put a SS extention over the cab.
     
  18. elite1msmith

    elite1msmith 2000 Club Member
    from chicago
    Messages: 2,762

    Let me ask you this... have you ever measured the acctual temperature of your oil? im sure B&B , and JD are old enough ..lol they remember those days when most if not all cars/trucks had a summer weight oil , and a winter weight oil? The heater system is a nice thought however shouldnt be nessesary by any means. I would think possibly going to a slightly Lighter weight oil , could be one of the correct solutions, I dunno, BB could chim in and tell me more on my thoughts. also the viscousity of synthetic doesnt change as much with climate change

    another thought is , run with that 15 gal tank, more at like 10 gals? less fluid = quicker warm up time, i know some ppl might disagree and want a full tank at all times, however, with the plow fully rased in the air, and your dump box fully rasied in the air (if you had one) , basicly any fluid that is being pumped out of that tank , should be returning on a 1 to 1 ratio...so , lossing a few gallons shouldnt hurt the system, it might bring the operating temp of the fluid up in the tank, faster i would think about 5 gals could run your system , but that might be too low

    thinking about my mowers, when you first start them up, at low speed, and while cold, moving the hydro levers only slightly , the machine hardly moves at all, I would check that you dont have a pressure relief, or the pressure for your spreader all the way down. this restricts flow, ?

    when you let it warm up, have you tried to just let the hydro system idle with the spreader off? with no load(salt) in the spreader, there is little to give the system a type of back pressure, .. i bring this up because, the fluid should heat up in a few different ways, fiction , at the pump, and motor, and pressure in the hose... no salt load = little pressure i would bet the fluid gains a few degrees at your pump, and by the time it makes it all the way to the rear of the truck, and then all the way back to the tank, alot of heat could have been lost along the way... would it be better to turn the PTO , or clutch on , but rather just let in cycle the tank fluid with out the spreader?
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2008
  19. elite1msmith

    elite1msmith 2000 Club Member
    from chicago
    Messages: 2,762

    one more thought on the hydro oil quanty.... your Zero turn mower has 2 pumps and 2 wheel motors.... your spreader has 2 wheel motors... your mower runs in 95 degree heat ,the prupose of the tank is too keep the temperature down, and to make the oil last longer, so its not constently pumping threw the system.... it gets a lunch break when it returns to that tank.....your mower has about a 1 gallon tank. so a 15 gal tank on a system that operates below freezing....just something to think about

    and both B&B , and JD are correct, the "wind chill cant make the temp drop below the air temp.... however , as Jd stated, and b&B confirmed , the wind chill will effect how quickly , things cool down..... from a warmer temperature... this includes the temp of your tank, and the fluid flowing throught the lines on the way to the spreader

    i would start by checking that your not trying to operate the system , at its minimal settings.... then consider a sythetic fluid replacement, and maybe 10 gals in the system .... heres a trick .... to make sure your not harming it in anyway , you need to take a temp gun , when doing this, and read normal operating temps at the pump, and motors... prior to the fluid change, then make sure that ur similar temps after. dont do too little fluid, that could starve the pump , when stepping on the brakes
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2008
  20. Jay brown

    Jay brown PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,783

    some good thoughts Elite.....the pump is a central unit under the hood and it is always on. in fact it doesn't have an on/off switch......