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Frustrated with failure points of frame

Discussion in 'SnowDogg Snow Plows' started by blwnsmoke, Jan 6, 2014.

  1. blwnsmoke

    blwnsmoke Member
    Messages: 62

    So I have an EX90 that I haven't used for not quite 4 years. Now upfront, I understand that plows do take a beating however I plow 3 Elementary Schools. These schools have no manholes, no speed bumps or curbs for me to hit or trip over. It is by far the easiest places to plow. The most stress the plow sees is stacking the piles of snow.

    So last winter my plow snapped as I was plowing one of the parking lots. I went to go up and the plow didn't go up. I jumped out to take a look and found this.

    [​IMG]

    I had to detach the plow, go get a bobcat to lift it into the bed of my truck and bring it down to our shop. Then had to go to the dealer and pick up a new part of that frame and install it. Dealer has never seen this ever before. So I chalk it up to a freak thing. However I will say that with my brother in laws fleet of 12 fishers, they've never done this.

    So this brings me to this morning. I went to detach my plow from plowing the storm Thursday/Friday (8" of fluffy powder) and noticed this…

    [​IMG]

    Now seriously.. I'm not exaggerating when I say the plow doesn't see much abuse. But how the hell does this happen? The most stress this plate sees is stopping the cylinders when angling. Just came back from the dealer and the mechanic says I'm the 3rd one he has seen in 9 years so clearly this shouldn't be happening.

    $514 for the frame part plus a couple hours of labor. Fortunately they had 1 in stock that they took from a new plow so I won't have to wait a few weeks to have it replaced.

    Anyone ever seen this before? Not trying to bash Snowdogg as I've been really impressed with how the plow operates but seems it is failing in places it shouldn't fails. Cylinders (maybe), hoses (sure), relays (of course), wires chaffing (over time). But frame parts failing????
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2014
  2. deicepro

    deicepro PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,124

    Don't pay that much....
    Fix it yourself.
    Do you have a welder..?
    You could beef it up and make it stronger than new....just my .02
     
  3. deicepro

    deicepro PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,124

    nevermind, I see you already got it fixed.. good luck
     
  4. blwnsmoke

    blwnsmoke Member
    Messages: 62

    I left the plow there with them to fix it. I don't have a welder. I am a sub for my brother in law so I don't do this full time. I just help out with the storms.

    I know what you mean about welding it but it is broken on both sides the same way, it is just wedged in there and not connected to anything. It's only $130 in labor which isn't a big deal to me for them to take the blade and springs off and reinstall on the new one. It's the cost of the frame that upsets me because I don't feel they should be failing in these locations. The first pic, it was only about $130 if I recall and I did it myself because it was only 4 bolts on each side and nothing had to come off but the headlights and arms they attach to.
     
  5. plowguy43

    plowguy43 PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 5,269

    If you were plowing during those really cold temps, it will make things break easily regardless of the make. Sucks that it happened though.
     
  6. blwnsmoke

    blwnsmoke Member
    Messages: 62

    I completely agree that things will break.. even regardless of temps. I understand plows take a beating. That plate however is a very low stress point. It only sees stress when the plow angles fully as it stops the cylinder from slamming when it goes full right or full left. Because there is no real "impact" compared to when you hit snow banks, sewer drains, curbs etc that put stress on the frame, I don't think this should have broke.
     
  7. Unrealo4

    Unrealo4 Junior Member
    Messages: 14

    This is all from stacking. Stack a bunch and get a ton of wet heavy snow all caught up in the frame and when you try and lift that bracket broke. Next im willing to bet that under that plate on the bottom of the plow there is a crack by the base of the pivot. When you stack it bends open the crack and that plate holds it from snapping the top half.
    This is from experience btw and im here to tell you if you stack you will have to buy a new frame period.
     
  8. TJS

    TJS PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,339

    So you can't stack with a dogg. No thanks. I will keep my old school diamond plow with a fisher mm1 conversion. I can stack all day long without issue.
     
  9. Unrealo4

    Unrealo4 Junior Member
    Messages: 14

    If you need to stack your doing it wrong. Why beat the crap out of your equipment? Even if it can take it or not. If you get to that point. Start charging for a skid steer and a dump trailer and haul it off. This way you make money instead of slam your $5k plow into a ice bank over and over.
     
  10. smoorman

    smoorman Sponsor
    Messages: 446

    The most common cause for the chain lift pivot damage is plowing while NOT in float. Guys who are used to joysticks sometimes don't hold down long enough, so you're plowing with the chain taut, putting a lot of extra load on it. The other issue is a lot less common, and I don't have any simple explanation for the cause. The only time that is normally under significant load is when you are pushing through deep snow (>12" deep) or if you trip the plow and try to drive over it. Both aren't typical conditions - and I'm not suggesting that's what happened in this case. Your dealer is welcome to call and talk to me.
     
  11. blwnsmoke

    blwnsmoke Member
    Messages: 62

    Thanks for the reply Scott. As far as the chain lift pivot, I can't say for sure that I hold it down long enough 100% of the time. I can say that I've only had a Snowdogg plow so I've never used a joystick. I generally hold the down button for several seconds in the style that I plow but maybe that one time I didn't and that's why it snapped. All in all, it wasn't that costly of a repair.

    It's the most recent failure that really has me baffled. I've plowed 2 storms so far, both storms were in the 0-10* temperature outside. Both of them were 100% fluff because of how cold it was. The storm that it broke on was an 8" storm but during those 8", I had plowed the lots 3 times so at most I was plowing 3" of snow at a time.

    I really do love my snowdogg but what is frustrating is that things that are breaking are things that shouldn't break in my opinion and things that should break don't. I talked to my dealer today and the repair is done but I haven't picked it up yet. I will have them call you Saturday or Monday (not sure if you work Saturdays)

    Like I said, not trying to trash your product, I really do like the plow and actually plan on buying a VXF for next season as I buy a new truck this Spring. I'm not switching brands regardless of whether Buyers will do anything for me. I completely understand that I'm out of warranty and know that you are not responsible for the repair but wouldn't be contacting you if I thought this should break.

    Thanks

    Brian
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2014
  12. blwnsmoke

    blwnsmoke Member
    Messages: 62

    Completely disagree. We do snow removal with a front loader and haul snow if needed. But that doesn't mean you can't/shouldn't push snow into a pile. I never apply the gas into a pile to stack. This pretty much slows the truck down gracefully as I approach the pile.

    Yes there are some that will hit a pile, then accelerate to really push it. This is my personal truck and my personal plow. I don't trash on my stuff like a regular employee would on a landscapers/company truck (I see it all the time with my brother's landscaping company and his employees just beating on his stuff). I need it to last because it's my daily driver and my personal plow so I take care of it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2014
  13. Unrealo4

    Unrealo4 Junior Member
    Messages: 14

    You act like I said any pile is to much. Of course we make piles and yes if done right with the right type of snow I also use the pile to slow down. It makes a nice tidy pile and can be 3-4ft tall in the right circumstances. I however dont refer to that as stacking. I see guys gunning it at the pile stacking snow above 5ft. Or doing it into a hardened pile of frozen snow.

    Making nice tidy piles is normal. Stacking snow taller then the truck is what I call abuse of our equipment and I see it all the time.
     
  14. blwnsmoke

    blwnsmoke Member
    Messages: 62

    I apologize if I took your comments the wrong way then. I don't know what others consider stacking. I completely agree with you in regards to pushing snow to 7ft+ piles is abuse. When it seems like your plow is going above your hood, there are issues with the plow driver and causing damage is to be expected and at the fault of the driver. No dispute there.
     
  15. SnoFarmer

    SnoFarmer PlowSite Fanatic
    from N,E. MN
    Messages: 8,437

    Plow trucks are made to work.
    work'em or park'em
    I want that snow stacked as high as you can get it.
    I don't want it taking up 3 parking spaces when it can take up 2.
    If you can't do it I will find someone who can.

    We rarely hall snow off of property's, so you will see stacks higher than the truck is.

    It's not beating it, it's working it.
    jmhao
     
  16. SnoFarmer

    SnoFarmer PlowSite Fanatic
    from N,E. MN
    Messages: 8,437

    Like this.
    If you now how to build your piles the plow will ramp right up as you lift the plow.
    and this plow truck is not being abused, it's being worked to make money,
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2014
  17. TJS

    TJS PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,339

    Well said. If you can't stack then pack it up.
     
  18. Unrealo4

    Unrealo4 Junior Member
    Messages: 14

    Lol I can stack snow....I never said I cant or couldnt. I just like making money (hauling off excessive piles). As opposed to beating the living crap out of my equipment. Im flabbergasted people would do that to their equipment. Instead you come here and complain that your equipment is not strong enough. Dont blame buyers for that I think you should look in the mirror. This is a plow gentleman not a hammer.
     
  19. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,853

    Nice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  20. SnoFarmer

    SnoFarmer PlowSite Fanatic
    from N,E. MN
    Messages: 8,437

    It's not hard for a plow to go threw it's range of motion while operating will in side it's envelope.
    The MFG's tout their plows stacking capability.

    You can really save on the brakes as the pile really slows you down.

    I buy my trucks to plow and that pile is not a spike and that plow is not a tack hammer.
    It's plowing snow.....what it was made to do and
    that is what it is doing.

    That "abused" plow is a 15yr old rtII.;)
    I still plow with it to day .

    Style, fineness and ability will get you a long way.

    Some of our customers balk at the added expense of hauling snow off site, some will point out the fact that your plowing is what is leading to the amount of space the piles take up.

    Push'em back and stack it up.

    If it operated like a electric spinner then it wouldn't be able to cut the mustard(stack), so we then would not recommend the plow.



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