1. Welcome to PlowSite. Notice a fresh look and new features? It’s now easier to share photos and videos, find popular topics fast, and enjoy expanded user profiles. If you have any questions, click HELP at the top or bottom of any page, or send an email to help@plowsite.com. We welcome your feedback.

    Dismiss Notice

Dump truck OR plain 5 ton truck with v-box for salting?

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by bcbrouwer, Jan 25, 2013.

  1. bcbrouwer

    bcbrouwer Member
    Messages: 45

    Maybe this should be under the ice control title, but this is certainly an element of commercial plowing. As the title suggests i'm trying to weight the pros and cons for a dedicated salt truck. I am going to get the rest of the year out of my 1.5 salt dogg and 3/4 ton truck, but man, 120+tons and 3-4 loads per storm is a lot of wasted time traveling and refilling for me. salting route takes too long. So next season is hopefully a bigger truck with a 5+ yard capacity, and the 1.5 yard salter as a backup or 2nd unit for max capacity. the bigger truck alone should cut the time in half, which really needs to happen to keep my costumers happy.

    So here is what I think to be the 2 best options for me.

    1) international single axle dump truck with 11' box and under-tailgate spreader

    OR

    2) similar truck body with no dump box, just a frame with a 5 yard sander/salter mounted to it.

    now for questions for those who care to answer them (which I really would like to hear some seasoned pros with their experience chime in)

    1) will they spread equally as good? I salt mostly medium sized commercial lots, 1/2 acre to 3 acres in size mostly. some roads as well.

    2) will bulk salt flow good enough in a dump truck? do I need a vibrator? the salt will be fairly dry and stored under cover.

    3) Im looking for longevity and reliability. the undertailgate seems like there is less to go wrong. any opinions?

    4) I currently do not have any uses for a year around dump truck, though i'm sure i would find some uses. Are there different registration or insurance requirements between these two types of trucks (I know i gotta check local requirements, just wondering what others say for their areas, maybe it doesn't matter?)

    5) what is the turning radius like on these types of trucks compared to a pickup?

    here are some pictures to show what 2 basic types of trucks im talking about. Thanks again for any help and info.

    truck.JPG

    truck2.jpg
     
  2. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 640

    I run two pickups with 8 ft vboxes that take care of the smaller jobs but I run a Ford L8000 single axle dump not unlike your first pic of the International fory bigger jobs. It has the under tailgate spreader an is very reliable tho trickier for some to get the hang of raising the box and spreading.You just have to take it easier but the spinner can really throw the salt which is nice for large lots and for shooting it under semi trailers. The Vbox idea isnt bad but will have more maintenance and you cant use the truck for anything else.
     
  3. NICHOLS LANDSCA

    NICHOLS LANDSCA PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 4,312

    With the dump you will have more versatility, just emptying extra salt out when you are done just raising the box is plus. With a V box bolted to the frame you only have a salt truck.
     
  4. geer hed

    geer hed Senior Member
    Messages: 275

    Go with the dump truck and tailgate spreader. It's more versatile. I drive an international now that used to have the V- box spreader and it sucked, we finaly got rid of ot and got the tailgate spreader for it and it's like night and day. You can haul more material, and as said before it's easier and faster to emty out, and if you should need it to haul something else you don't have to remove the spreader to haul it.
     
  5. JD Dave

    JD Dave PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,046

    The V box will be twice the salt truck as the undergate and basically anyone can run it trouble free. I hate undergates with a passion.
     
  6. NICHOLS LANDSCA

    NICHOLS LANDSCA PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 4,312

    Ya but not everyone has your money to have dedicated salt trucks:D
     
  7. Red_Rattler

    Red_Rattler Senior Member
    Messages: 201

    If I wanted a truck for salt and thats it... VBOX all the way and yes put a vibrator on it, no matter how dry your salt or truck is, its sucks any and all the moisture out of the air it can and will clump and become sticky
     
  8. Longae29

    Longae29 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,953

    I couldn't agree more.

    Besides ease of operation, I think there is also a lot of salt wasted with the undertailgate especially on your smaller lots to get into the nooks and crannies.

    Go with the chassis mount vbox you won't be sorry
     
  9. bcbrouwer

    bcbrouwer Member
    Messages: 45

    Thanks guys. just wondering, why is that some of you hate the under-gate? what reasons is it inferior to a v box? Also, how do you waste extra salt? I assume most under-gate salters have independent auger and spinner control so you can shut it on and off as you would a v box?

    Just wondering, i'm not too educated or experienced with this stuff. I know you need to run the dump body up some to keep the salt flowing to the back which is not good for low clearance places or stability (from what i've searched), but other than that I cant see too many negatives for me. but I have been wrong many times! thanks
     
  10. xtreem3d

    xtreem3d PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,548

    I have an IH similar to the first one pictured ..an S series..it turns amazingly sharp compared to my dodges. I have an UTG spreader..I can't imagine using a V box on the truck..a gazillion more moving parts..you will need something big to get it on and off the truck (unless it's frame mounted)..you will something big to reach the top/ middle of the box to load it..if its a dump you can still use the truck..easy to unload..V box will cost more..but that's just me.............
    http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?p=1539356#post1539356

    PS I don't run my body up very often even though I have a body up light..I just dump salt to the back then lower and salt.
     
  11. Longae29

    Longae29 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,953

    The three under tailgates we have are hydraulic. Auger and spinner can be operated at different rates but on/off is not independent. It takes a more skilled operator to run the under tailgate, it takes a lot of practice to balance engine rpms with travel speed. The undertaigate is fine for your 3+ acre lots but on those smaller ones and roads the vbox is going to be better. Most of your undertailgates are going to spread from the middle of the truck out past the passenger side giving you a void on the drivers side so you have to turn around to spread the opposite direction which is where I see the waste. The vbox spreads even to both sides (or should). Loading docks can be a real p.I.t.a with the undertailgate
     
  12. MatthewG

    MatthewG PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,390

    I have a 5-6 ton Monroe stainless steel V box in the bed of my 33,000LB dump body - never again.

    Next year its an aluminum dump bed with stainless tailgate spreader
     
  13. geer hed

    geer hed Senior Member
    Messages: 275

    First If you get a v box on a truck like that and don't go full hydraulic your just wasting your money. Now if you do go with hydraulic the controls should be the same. you will have a box inside the cab that has a lever on it with 2 dials, the lever turns the spreader on and off, the dials are for the spinner and conveyer. you can control them independantly by turning one or the other up or down. The problem with them is that the only adjustment for pattern or lane is by moving the flaps at the spinner up or down.

    Now with a tailgate spreader the controls are the same as the V box, but you have more control over where your material goes. You slide the spinner left or right in order to control where it lands, If you slide the spinner left you will throw the material ALL to the left of the truck, slide it right and it throws it all to the right side of the truck. You will have to play with it a bit until you find where it needs to be to throw the pattern you want.

    I have used both type spreders on different trucks, I have plowed and salted everything from a driveway to a 4 lane highway, and from a small bank parking lot to the parking lot a Roadway trucking depot. Trust me the tailgate is the way to go.

    Plus the pics of the two trucks you have posted, The second one may not be equiped with a hydraulic system yet which would be an additional cost for set up, where you know the dump allready has it. and if your doing P lots I'm not sure by the pic but the second truck looks like it has a longer frame which will make manuvering more dificult.
     
  14. Grassman09

    Grassman09 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,806

    I have to agree with Dave. For the last 2 years I ran a under tailgate on my dedicated salt truck. Everything runs off central hydraulics. I hated how my guys would rev the snot out of my truck to get the box raised to slide the salt to the back or jamb on the brakes to get salt to slide. Also you need to be carefully of lights overhead power lines and trees with a under tailgate.

    Now with the vbox in the box salting is a breeze. Next season box will come off and mount salter to frame of the truck.

    You will like those internationals. Mine turns tighter then my pickups.

    image.jpg
     
  15. MatthewG

    MatthewG PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,390

    How does the salt even spread from that spreader with the chutes pointing directly at the ground?
     
  16. Grassman09

    Grassman09 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,806

    In the chute of the spinner there is a flap. Flip it to the left it salts heavy to the right and visa versa.
     
  17. Grassman09

    Grassman09 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,806

    Come stand beside it trust me it will whip it 2 to 3 lanes wide with spinner on high. I was doing walks today as my driver was doing the lane ways I got pelted a lil. That spinner sits pretty high so I have it like that so we do not pelt cars. I see what u mean now. We have them adjusted now. That was when I was putti g fluid film on chain so I didn't get covered In it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  18. xtreem3d

    xtreem3d PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,548

    You really can't fault the UTG spreader for your guys running the truck hard and I/you don't have to salt with the bed up. I raise my bed so the salt slides back , mostly at a standstill unless I am in the middle of an open lot, then lower and salt. I probably raise my 10 foot bed about 4 times to empty it
    PS I was lucky enough to have my vinyl/sign guy give me an old polycarbonite sign from a sandwich shop which I temporarily layed in my bed so no salt could stick to the steel floor..it is amazing !!
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  19. MatthewG

    MatthewG PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,390

    Ok, I have the same spread and I have my rear flap off and the side flaps 80% up, it spreads the same as yours about 60 feet but main coverage is about 30 foot based on spinner speed
     
  20. bcbrouwer

    bcbrouwer Member
    Messages: 45

    thats also a good idea, I was thinking that same thing for a dump truck to have some poly or a non friction surface to let the salt move more freely. nice looking setup you have btw. what kind of salter is it that you have? thanks.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013