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Can't resolve No Power to motor without more help

Discussion in 'Western Plows Discussion' started by 2old4this, Dec 31, 2006.

  1. 2old4this

    2old4this Junior Member
    from CT
    Messages: 6

    Great site, especially for someone like me who is new to plowing, and of course its equipment, and President of the CRS Club (the old timers will get it).

    I’ve read may posts here regarding my problem and have made some headway thanks to all of you but I am now a bit confused where to look next.

    I know there have been many postings like this and I read as many as I could find, which is what got me this far, but they are all starting to run together.

    Everything worked great last year, truck sat the whole summer, now no response from plow at all. It’s an older Western, cable activated.

    What I did: cleaned every, and I mean cleaned every cable I could find and replaced some just to be sure Now I’m scared that that rust was the only thing holding the truck together.

    Installed a new solenoid, added an extra HD ground wire from its base to the frame for ground. Yes I got it from the auto parts store, it has as pictured on the Western site the two power lugs and two smaller terminals, one that gets jumped to the battery side and the other gets the black wire from the control.

    I can’t get power to the motor side of the solenoid. If I put the control lever in the cab in the raise position and run a jumper cable from the positive side of the battery direct to the motor it runs and the blade goes up.

    Do I have the wrong solenoid, what am I missing in diagnosing the problem?:dizzy:


    Thanks…Dave
     
  2. LON

    LON Senior Member
    Messages: 749

    do you have power in one of the small wires when the cable is in the raise or angle position? If not you may just have a blown in-line fuse which should be between the ignition accessory source and the controller.
    Lon
     
  3. 2old4this

    2old4this Junior Member
    from CT
    Messages: 6

    Fuse?

    I can't find any in line fuse. According to the manual I downloaded from Western no use of a fuse is shown. The control box in the cab has 2 cables going to the pump and a black wire going to the solenoid, and I can't find any indication that any of the wiring connects to the fuse box or has a fuse-able link. The other small terminal on the solenoid has constant power as it has a jumer wire from it to the battery side large terminal.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2006
  4. B&B

    B&B PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 12,777

    There wont be a fuse. The wire coming from the joystick to the solenoid supplies ground to the solenoid....not power. Your problem is your solenoid. The "parts store" solenoid's wont work on the old cable pump's do to the fact that they are triggered by 12V NOT ground like your system does.You need to get the correct western solenoid and your problem's will be solved.
     
  5. 2old4this

    2old4this Junior Member
    from CT
    Messages: 6

    B&B...

    Thanks for putting me out of my misery...it's been a couple of long days trying to resolve this.

    I've seen some on line parts suppliers listed in other postings, if I can't find someone local (who's not trying to put their kid through college) I'll order from one of them.

    Happy New Year and thanks again.

    Dave
     
  6. B&B

    B&B PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 12,777

    No problem buddy,if you dont find one local you can order one from CPW at the top of the page.
     
  7. IndySnowPlow

    IndySnowPlow Senior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 214

    Yes they will work.....I buy them from Autozone (locally) for $7.00each, you have to get one for a FORD,,,,it will have -2- small posts and the one on the left (as its facing you) is the one you connect the ground lead to from the joystick.

    Carquest & NAPA sells the exact same part for $35.00 YIKES :dizzy:

    If needed I can go out to one of my trucks and get the box & part number for you.
     
  8. Rickco

    Rickco Member
    Messages: 89

    A starter selinoid will work,for a short period of time. They are not made to have continuous use. Go to a plow dealer and get what you need. It doesn't matter,Western/fisher/boss. They all will work on a western,I'm not sure about others as theese are ones I've used on my western. They cost about $17 so just get the right piece and stop driving yourself nuts.
     
  9. 2old4this

    2old4this Junior Member
    from CT
    Messages: 6

    $9.34 from AutoZone, that's where I went.

    If it's the one on the left as the unit faces me than I've reversed the connections. With the relay mounted to the fender, and the bottom side of it facing me, while looking over the fender, I've got the small terminal on the right jumped to the positive lug and the one on the left to the control.

    Winter hasn't hit us in the Northeast as yet and I don't want to have another episode with the unit once it does, so tomorrow I'm off to the local dealerprsport and buy the correct part.

    It wasn't a question of cost but not knowing these units, in general, are not interchangeable.

    Thanks to all for your help, I'll let you know how it all ends.
     
  10. popov_plow

    popov_plow Junior Member
    Messages: 13

    if you have an advance auto near you you might want to check there. I got an aftermarket SAM soleniod for isamartics they had it in stock less than $10.
    good luck
     
  11. 2old4this

    2old4this Junior Member
    from CT
    Messages: 6

    I tried Advanced Auto's web site and they didn't have one listed.

    I ended up getting one from Levine Auto and Truck parts in Bethel, CT.

    They carry the SAM line as well and had one in stock. Took two trips as they thought the 56131 and 56131K were the same part...WRONG, and my wife didn't know when she picked it up.

    It was $13.95 and an exact match to the Western orginal (even included a jumper wire), haven't had the chance to install it as yet.
     
  12. property mgr

    property mgr Junior Member
    Messages: 20

    Use a Western Solinoid

    I'm a rookie here, however, I recently purchased an old cable plow, hooked it up and could not get the motor to respond. Motor worked when power was applied directly to motor. (disconnect all power cables, then jumper cables directly to motor terminal and motor ground) Solenoid did not pass the trouble shooting tests, so a mechanic friend thought that any similar solenoid from the autoparts store should function properly here. The new solenoid tested good but it did not work in this application since the Western theory of operation uses a different path of energy than most car solenoids--engineered differently. (others on this site or at the Western dealership can probably explain this better than I--but that's the short version of what my mechanic explained to me after we solved the problem. A friend did tell me later that some truck solenoids may work in the Western application but may not be heavy duty enough for all the plow activity. I'm sure others on this site can help us both here with specifics. In any case, my autoparts guy did not guess correctly--my substitute did not work)

    After many frustrating tests, we determined that the solenoid was not functioning the way the Western energy path required. We gave in for the night, went to the Western dealer the next day and purchased and OEM Western solenoid for the Isarmatic Cable Plow. Hooked up the Western solenoid, the motor functioned perfectly in all positions--up, right, left. Until I find a correct autoparts store stock substitute, I'll keep an extra Western OEM solenoid on hand prior to a big snow--fairly inexpensive insurance.

    Again, I'm a rookie here but this sounds very similar to my problem. Hope this helps.
     
  13. B&B

    B&B PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 12,777

    Indy, do you have the part no. for the solenoid? I've never been able to find a starter solenoid that one terminal was ground activated.Every one I checked was triggered by 12V ( as they usually are), not ground. That's why I say that the parts store solenoid wont work on the cable pump's.
     
  14. 2old4this

    2old4this Junior Member
    from CT
    Messages: 6

    70 degrees in CT today, and I'm fixing my plow!!!

    The S.A.M. part was indeed the correct one, worked perfectly.:nod:

    Now for a Y-Pipe and muffler, does it even end.

    Thanks to all for the help.:waving: