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Building my liquid de-icer unit

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by hickslawns, Sep 26, 2006.

  1. hickslawns

    hickslawns Senior Member
    Messages: 617

    I am building my liquid de-icing unit and thought I would look for some opinions. Right or wrong, educated or uneducated. I think I am going to go electric on the first one to mount to an ATV. This should be simple. I am going with a gas motor on the next two which I hope can double to do liquid fert next spring. I have a power washer that crapped the pump after maybe 20 uses. Just out of warranty, imagine that. It is 4.5HP Honda w/ vert shaft. I am thinking of using a pulley and belt drive to a silver series roller pump. I should be able to do the math to figure gal/min and a pressure regulator should help figure PSI. I have a 275gal and 375gal tank, and a 1500gal tank to be used for storage of premixed solution. I plan on getting the electric shut off gate (maybe not the right name of what I am referring to) and running it into the cab thru the slider window which will allow me to swap between trucks in the event of breakdown. I will be making a spray boom approx 9' wide and put a couple nozzles on the ends at an angle to reach out another couple feet. This will slide into the receiver. I might eventually get a hose reel for hard to reach areas. Not sure about plumbing it in so I can use either the reel or the boom. Figure that out later. I know there are more details, but have I left anything out? How big of roller pump will I need? Is a roller pump the way to go? Are there any major differences between these and fertilizer sprayers? Is this a sound idea or should I scrap it and try something else? Any input appreciated, I am pretty much green at liquid other than internet research and open to opinion. Thanks
     
  2. fulltiltwill

    fulltiltwill Senior Member
    Messages: 204

    Hey Hicks

    Hey Hicks,
    Looks like we're back at it again (looking into liquid) this year. I decided to buy a 15g atv spot sprayer with 2.1gpm 12v pump. I am is the process rigging to a drop spreader so I can use it on my walks. That way I can see how well it works and play with the mixes and learn a little about the whole process with out putting alot of money into it.
    As far as I have read and talked to people. If you are putting a rig together for a truck it is better to go with a gas motor and a roller pump, 4,6 or 8 so I have heard. Building the boom seems straight forward. I was thinking rain drop fan style nozzles that match the psi of the pump and space them every 12"s. The ones on the ends on an angle sounds like a good Idea. The part I am still trying to figure out is the actual plumbing of the unit. Is it the same as a spot sparyer with a pick up hose to the pump then to the boom or is it more involved for the agitator and switching from wand to boom? I have talked to people at Lesco and places Like Tractor Sales Co for any input and everybody has a different answer. So if you get anything together be sure to let us know how it goes.
    Thanks Adam
     
  3. hickslawns

    hickslawns Senior Member
    Messages: 617

    Thanks Will- I am still figuring the split from outlet to the spray tips too. Maybe our Cincy friend Fernalddude will chime in. Seems pretty doable. I just need to do the math to figure RPM's of the engine coupled with the roller pump based upon what pulleys I use and then I will know gal/min. I plan on putting my dually in 1st gear, letting the clutch out and idling along the lots, so 5mph coupled with the gal/min should let me know if I am putting the correct amount per sq ft or not. I am going to do some "dry" runs with water only and track the distance it goes for something like 50 gals of water and this should detect leaks and whether or not I am putting down the right amounts. Anyone with input either way or think I am going the wrong direction?
     
  4. fernalddude

    fernalddude PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,105

    ok guys iam ready the dry runs work great been busy with dads opp on his new knee so give what i can ......
     
  5. nsmilligan

    nsmilligan PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 704

    I built a homemade liquid rig. I went with a 12v roller pump, the diaphraqm pumps couldn't cut it when it got cold. The other thing I found is I needed a manufactured suction line as the tubing would collaspe in cold weather.I only use my rig for pre-treating, so I went with a boominator noozle, it gives 16' of coverage without a boom.
    I had some pics, but I lost them when I upgraded the box this summer, I can take a few if you like.

    Bill
     
  6. BSDeality

    BSDeality Senior Member
    Messages: 736

    pictures and detail shots would be greatly appreciated. I am looking to convert my 60gal tank over this winter to run out of the back of my small truck. What did you choose for a manifold? If the market is there I will add a 300-400gallon unit to my F350.

    I'm thinking of using a TeeJet 460 2-way to control a small boom that would have three sets of nozzles (QJ360) multiple spray nozzle body. This way I could go from a fan spray to a jet-stream to break up packed snow/ice better..
     
  7. hickslawns

    hickslawns Senior Member
    Messages: 617

    I am not going to use the fan spray. From my understanding they tend to lose too much in the air before hitting the ground. Besides that, for pretreating I think it should splatter and spread out on the ground anyway. It also will spread between the tips' spray patterns as the moisture activates the solution and they end up merging together anyway. Straight stream for me. Thanks for getting the ideas rolling guys. Any other ideas before I start buying supplies? I basically just need the pump, plumbing, and some metal to do some fabrication work to hold it all together.

    Good tip on the suction line and staying away from the diaphram pumps Bill.

    Fernalddude-hope all is well in Cincy and your Dad is up and running soon.
     
  8. hickslawns

    hickslawns Senior Member
    Messages: 617

    I am not going to use the fan spray. From my understanding they tend to lose too much in the air before hitting the ground. Besides that, for pretreating I think it should splatter and spread out on the ground anyway. It also will spread between the tips' spray patterns as the moisture activates the solution and they end up merging together anyway. Straight stream for me. Thanks for getting the ideas rolling guys. Any other ideas before I start buying supplies? I basically just need the pump, plumbing, and some metal to do some fabrication work to hold it all together.

    Good tip on the suction line and staying away from the diaphram pumps Bill.

    Fernalddude-hope all is well in Cincy and your Dad is up and running soon.
     
  9. parrothead

    parrothead Senior Member
    Messages: 157

    i understand you've already made your mind up on the straight stream but would you conside this for a moment. the state and municipal people run straight streams on the roads where they get a lot of fast traffic to mix the solution in and they have to be able to put alot down fast traveling down the road. you are probably only going to be going less than 10 miles per hour in a parking lot, so it will be easier to put the right amount on. you need to set your pump up for about 40 gal per acre@10 mph. you will be better off putting down a broadcast application, sort of like teflan on a pan, so the snow and ice dont stick. thats the way im set up and i thought you might like to set your rig up now and not be changing it over in the cold of the winter. good luck, rob
     
  10. DugHD

    DugHD Senior Member
    from Maine
    Messages: 420

    Thanks for the info. I am going to build a sprayer for my truck . 275 gal tank. I will be watching you guys post pics and help if i can. doug
     
  11. BSDeality

    BSDeality Senior Member
    Messages: 736

    I built a nurse tank for another aspect of my business this summer using stainless steel for the skid-frame, I really like the way it came out other than I realized halfway through that I should have used SS wire in the MIG welder. I may make another one this winter and do it right with SS wire. I figure SS would be the best material to use for such harsh environments. I get my SS for $1/lb off the local scrap guy. If you have a welder there is no reason you couldn't make this whole thing yourself if you have the time.

    I have a 5gpm/70PSI pump that I may try to use first, although I will probably go with a roller pump in the end.
     
  12. hickslawns

    hickslawns Senior Member
    Messages: 617

    Parrothead-thanks for the suggestion. I have not completely made up my mind on anything other than I am building at least one, and probably a smaller one for an ATV or mower later on. This is why I posted. I am taking and considering all input seriously. If you are already spraying liquid and have found certain things work better than others, by all means let me know. Thanks. I should be able to swap tips fairly quickly anyway, but I will buy both now that you mentioned it and see how each performs. I do realize different locations and different weather patterns are going to alter performance.
     
  13. BSDeality

    BSDeality Senior Member
    Messages: 736

    anyone got some pictures? I'm interested in booms, manifolds, tips and so on.
     
  14. Potomac Lawns

    Potomac Lawns Member
    Messages: 90

    so how are you making out on the unit?

    Steve
     
  15. kipcom

    kipcom Senior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 455

    OK...Im not going to give it away for free( since I patented the concept & 1st design )

    Rules for Liquid application of salt brine OR road heat:

    NO Plastic or rubber
    Liquid container for road apps min. 500 gal ( it goes fast with proper app. rate )
    Install a tank heater ( or your stuff will freeze up )

    Tractor Supply type places have all of the fittings you need OR check your local plumbing supply house.

    Quads w/ fert sprayers... NO NO NO..they will Freeze up on you !!!!

    Remember: Its cold out there, thats why the liquid your trying to break down is FROZEN in the 1st place.
     
  16. NASConst_land

    NASConst_land Member
    Messages: 54

    Hicks,

    We have a lesco tank spraying unit that has a fold out boom on it i believe 4 nozzles on each boom. It is a pretty sweet set up we thought about using it, but we are just going to stick with our salt. We are looking to get rid of the unit, if u dont already have something built this is all set up u could just put it on a bigger tank and be all set. Let me know if you want to see it, I think it said u were from Northwest Ohio, we are on Old Airport hwy, right in the area.
     
  17. cincy snowdog

    cincy snowdog Senior Member
    Messages: 262

    what are you running salt brine or calcium chloride or? calcium chloride sprayed on salt and your salt is on time sensitive time frame. or it is a rock.if on ground that will get costly.salt brine can be effective and is cheap if you pretreat but you have to have mixing tank to get gravity right or freeze up .a tank can be a plastic with two inch outlet that goes into a bar like a t with hoses hanging to ground to keep spray down .how about looking into driveway sealer sprayer wands too.one is able industries or brewer coat .i will take a pic of one of trucks for brine pretreat(in the bed). the calcium tanks are part of the truck hanging under the bed.ok just my thoughts
     
  18. DugHD

    DugHD Senior Member
    from Maine
    Messages: 420

    Heres a pic of some of my pieces I am putting together to build a calcium sprayer.

    equipment pics 006 (Small).jpg

    equipment pics 007 (Small).jpg
     
  19. DugHD

    DugHD Senior Member
    from Maine
    Messages: 420

    The little homelite pump runs like a champ. I am going to make a skid for the pump and tank to slide into pickup. I am building the manifold out of pvc. I need to find a electric shut-off valve. I also have some more tanks if anyone wants to buy one. They are 330 gal. plastic totes used one time for mineral oil. They are in excellent shape . I'm selling them for $150 ea. Doug
     
  20. DugHD

    DugHD Senior Member
    from Maine
    Messages: 420

    If anyone has a close up pics of the plumbing to there sprayer would be nice to see. I was thinking of running one to the manifold and a by-pass line back to the tank when the valve is closed for the spray manifold. Was hoping to find a electric valve for the shut off, so i can start the pump in the back of truck & then go in the truck and click on sprayer when needed. doug