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Brine, Beet Juice, Calcium - What is the best product or combination based on my cost

Discussion in 'Ice Management' started by absolutely, Dec 9, 2014.

  1. absolutely

    absolutely Senior Member
    Messages: 237

    We are in a region were I can get Sodium Chloride for $.83 gallon picked up, Beet Juice for $.53 gallon picked up and Calcium Chloride for $.52 a gallon delivered. We are mainly treating salt at the spinner and are currently working on a truck sprayer for pre treating (1000 gallon). Should I just use calcium for everything? Please give me some advice. Ultimately we are trying to reduce our salt consumption at a cost of $135 a ton delivered and give our customer the best outcome.

    Thanks for the help.
     
  2. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,887

    PM me your e-mail and I'll give you my recommendations.

    Just saw your business card, but I don't feel like going through my stack of cards again. lol
     
  3. Jet Stream

    Jet Stream Junior Member
    Messages: 27

    I can get you a truckload delivered (+-4400 gallons) for 50 cents a gallon in Michigan.

    While exact concentrations will vary slightly, our liquid calcium chloride product contains:
    21 to 24% Calcium Chloride
    4.11 to 5% Magnesium Chloride
    1.68 to 2% Potassium Chloride
    3.78 to 4% Sodium Chloride

    Let me know if I can help. Susan, Jet Stream Fuels, 786-566-0195 scromer@jetstreamfuels.com

    Have you seen our ad here on Plowsite? We have salt in stock -- bulk, bagged and brine delivered to you by the truckload. WE DID NOT RUN OUT OF SALT LAST YEAR!
     
  4. LapeerLandscape

    LapeerLandscape PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,613

    I would like to hear what you have to say about it also.
     
  5. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,887

    I'd rather type it once, so send me your e-mail as well.
     
  6. absolutely

    absolutely Senior Member
    Messages: 237

    Sent, Thanks, Mark!
     
  7. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,887

    Email sent.
     
  8. LapeerLandscape

    LapeerLandscape PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,613

    Thank you Mark
     
  9. John_DeereGreen

    John_DeereGreen PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,901

  10. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,887

    Don't do it.

    Lol

    I did.
     
  11. John_DeereGreen

    John_DeereGreen PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,901

    Thanks Mark!
     
  12. Defcon 5

    Defcon 5 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,697

    Wheres my email????...........I thurst for knowledge........:eek:
     
  13. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,887

    Didn't think your daughter was home to read it to you yet.
     
  14. STARSHIP

    STARSHIP Member
    Messages: 35

    This liquid salt rookie is eager to learn too. We have been treating our bulk salt at the spinner with a state-of-the-art 25 gallon Tractor Supply 4GPM system for 2 years now, lol, but would like to move into more liquids. Eventually we plan to set up a liquid only rig. If I could get that email as well, that would be awesome. My email is basemanb@aol.com.
     
  15. msm63

    msm63 Junior Member
    Messages: 17

    Would like to hear more about this to, if either Mark or Josh are up for sharing I would appreciate it.

    mskilawn@gmail.com
     
  16. Icemelters

    Icemelters Inactive
    Messages: 19

    Beet juice is usually Mag based and the chloride weight is the lowest of the brine solutions

    Calcium (probably mineral well brine) holds the most chlorides in solution

    Sodium holds the second most chlorides in solution

    Potassium isn't worth mentioning

    So of the choices here's what you are paying for the chloride

    Beet juice is about 20% chloride in solution--each percent of equates to lbs of chloride per gallon (the water melts nothing) -- so in this mixture you are getting about 2 lbs of chloride per gallon

    CC well brine comes about 27% on average (hopefully you get more) so you have 2.7lbs of chloride per gallon

    Sodium chloride (rock salt dissolved in water) normally is made to a 23.3% solution or about 2.3lbs of chlorides per gallon

    Amount of gallons that equal 1 ton of rock salt

    Beet juice 2000/2.0 = 1000 gal x .53 = $530 per ton equiv.
    CC 2000/2.7 = 740 gal x .52 = $384 per ton equivalent
    Na 2000/2.3 = 870 gal x .83 = $722 per ton equivalent

    Each of these solutions will activate your rock salt at the spinner at almost the same rate--use the cheapest one per ton of salt equivalent
     
  17. Winteriscoming

    Winteriscoming Junior Member
    Messages: 8

    I do like your thought process Icemelters. They sell beet juice out there plain too, but we have all learned over the years that the beet by-products are not so "hot". Anyone adding water to nacl to make a nacl brine, IMO, is wasting time and money. Water, ice, is what you're trying to melt, why dilute your brs? Sure if you want to make a dusting go away at 30degreesF its fine but out of that your not accomplishing much. Treat it with an obpe liquid, preferably cacl based and move on.
     
  18. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,887

    Does beet juice contain mag naturally?

    Or is it being added? Like Magic or whatever the crap they're calling it this year.
     
  19. Mark Oomkes

    Mark Oomkes PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,887

    brs?

    obpe?

    Please school me oh most wise one.

    When applying sodium chloride to snow or ice, are we not adding water to sodium chloride? Are you saying that is a waste?

    The only thing I have to say is that the claims made by some that they are de-icing with 50 or 60 gallons per acre is bovine excrement, at least in Michigan. Maybe out West where snow is generally a lower moisture content and the sun usually comes out after a storm.