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Apartment Complex bidding for A straight Noob!

Discussion in 'Bidding & Estimating' started by chazmanian, Oct 17, 2007.

  1. chazmanian

    chazmanian Member
    Messages: 93

    Great forum you folks have here....I have been lurking about reading up on the snow removal biz and like what I have seen.

    I run a fairly profitable and fully funtional parking lot striping company & I have decided to plow some lots this year to stay busy and make some extra income. I feel I have good overall business sense but I'm lost and confused when it comes to this plowing business. I have an old 1999 F-250 4x4 truck that I'm getting a new 7.5 western plow and some low priced spreading device mounted on the rear. My striping insrance covered my plowing for an extra $80 per year.....Nice. I have several seasonal employees who are excited about shoveling?? Jeezus. I have a good grasp of plowing itself as I managed a large car dealership for 10 years and made myself responsible for plowing the lot throughout the snowy months.

    So.... I have a good sized apartment complex that wants to give us a shot. There are apprx 150 parking stalls set around the perimeter of an oddly shaped parking area. It looks like a concrete golf course. I'm proposing $75.00 for truck and plow, $25.00 for shoveling. 100.00 per ton of salt, $65.00 per ton of sand, $25.00 per hour to spread ice melt.

    I have no clue as to how long it will take me and the manager wants a bid tommorow.....What do Y'all think of submitting my proposal in this format??

    Submitted by Concrete Clean Oct 18th 2007

    Vendor will remove snow from Apartment complex parking area after a 1.75"-2" accumlation.

    Special consideration is made for extremely heavy snowfall. In this case a path will be plowed from the main entry and through the main drive areas as soon as possible.

    Vendor will utilize Potassium Chloride Ice melt sparingly after shoveling in order to deter continued accumulation and to prevent icy patches from forming.

    Ice melt will be used liberally in areas that do not recive sun.

    Vendor shall return daily to monitor the need for Ice melt and reapply if necessary.

    Ice melt will not be shoveled or throw onto planted or landscaped areas.

    Vendor will take great care not to damage curbs. Any newly damaged curbs will be repaired by the Vendor at seasons end.

    Vendor will restripe the parking area markings at no extra cost at seasons end.

    Cost of Service: Truck and Plow $75.00 per hour (Fair & Equitable billable Plow time TBD By Concrete Clean & Mgmt per occurance & snow depth.)
    Sweep/Shovel $25.00 Per hour (When Requested By Mgmt)
    Ice melt $25.00 Per Hour (TBD On Need)
    Sand $65.00 per ton. (Apprx .50-75 Tons per occurance)
    Salt $100.00 Per Ton (Apprx .50 Tons per occurance)
    Any changes or additional work is easily accomplished prior to starting job.
    XXXXXXX Apartments will be listed as additional insured on CGL policy with Seneca Commercial Ins. Our company carries One Million per occurance in liability Ins.
    Vendor agree's to hold Owner, Management and their Employees harmless against any negligance on behalf of the Vendor with regards to the above referenced work.


    Do yall think I'm on the right track here as I do not have a clue how many hours any of this will take???
     
  2. Mick

    Mick PlowSite.com Veteran
    from Maine
    Messages: 5,546

    Generally, I'd say you're taking way too much responsibility and liability on yourself and your company.

    I'm kind of wondering - Why are you offering both salt and sand? Are you going to use different products in different areas? Is that straight sand or a sand/salt mix? You do realize that straight sand will easily freeze into a solid lump?
     
  3. chazmanian

    chazmanian Member
    Messages: 93

    I dunno...Most of the verbage is from my painting scope of work and the sand / salt thing was something I got from another scope of work for a shopping mall.

    Lose the sand salt and make a mixed rate?

    Lije say a mix of sand and salt at 80.00 a ton and straight salt or ice melt at 100.00??

    Liability??? Eliminate the we take all responsibily line>>

    Help me out here Mick!
     
  4. chazmanian

    chazmanian Member
    Messages: 93

    Submitted by Concrete Clean Oct 18th 2007

    Vendor will remove snow from Apartment complex parking area after a 1.75"-2" accumlation.

    Special consideration is made for extremely heavy snowfall. In this case a path will be plowed from the main entry and through the main drive areas as soon as possible.

    Vendor will utilize Potassium Chloride Ice melt sparingly after shoveling in order to deter continued accumulation and to prevent icy patches from forming.

    Ice melt will be used liberally in areas that do not recive sun.

    Vendor shall return daily to monitor the need for Ice melt and reapply if necessary.

    Ice melt will not be shoveled or throw onto planted or landscaped areas.

    Vendor will take great care not to damage curbs. Any newly damaged curbs will be repaired by the Vendor at seasons end.

    Vendor will restripe the parking area markings at no extra cost at seasons end.

    Cost of Service: Truck and Plow $75.00 per hour (Fair & Equitable billable Plow time TBD By Concrete Clean & Mgmt per occurance & snow depth.)
    Sweep/Shovel $25.00 Per hour (When Requested By Mgmt)
    Ice melt $25.00 Per Hour (TBD On Need)
    Sand Salt Mix $80.00 per ton. (Apprx .50-75 Tons per occurance)
    Salt $100.00 Per Ton (Apprx .50 Tons per occurance)
    Any changes or additional work is easily accomplished prior to starting job.
    XXXXXXX Apartments will be listed as additional insured on CGL policy with Seneca Commercial Ins. Our company carries One Million per occurance in liability Ins.

    .
     
  5. Mick

    Mick PlowSite.com Veteran
    from Maine
    Messages: 5,546

    I can't really help with prices. If you're ok with those, go with them.
     
  6. Mick

    Mick PlowSite.com Veteran
    from Maine
    Messages: 5,546

    Going to bed now. If you want, I'll be back here about 7:00 Eastern time.
     
  7. cet

    cet PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,202

    I would never spread anything by the hour. It is very quick to do. I bet you spread that place in 15 minutes. You say you are getting a rear mounted spreader. Most likely that won't spread sand/salt mix or even bulk salt. I don't think you should say 1.75 to 2" for a trigger, pick one. If you get 1.875 and you decide not to show up they might say the contract says 1.75. Working by the hour I bet you will show though. If you haven't already bought the blade I would get a 8' or 8'6".
     
  8. LoneCowboy

    LoneCowboy PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,760

    I don't know where you are in Colorado, but if you are on the front range (or in the resorts) those prices are WAY too low. That's lower than what it was back in the early 90's. Personally I'm not getting out of bed for that. I don't believe your $90 plowing insurance either, I'm in colorado mine is a ton extra on top of my commercial and general liability. I would take a LONG hard look at that policy.

    Not everyone realizes Colorado is special. The sun shines here, we don't spread much salt (not like back east, it melts here, 25 degrees one day, 60 the next)
    People spread salt on the sidewalks and a salt/gravel (10/90) mix on the roads/parking lots. You're right to bid it seperately. Just put it in as shoveler time, don't bid it seperately (for time) or just make the cost of the salt or sand/salt mix enough to cover your labor.

    Nobody does this either
    . Give them a reduced price if you want, but nobody does that.
     
  9. chazmanian

    chazmanian Member
    Messages: 93

    My policy is a 2 million dollar CGL for Line striping big retail store lots that we do in 5 different states over the summer. Its acually only $80 more to add plowing to the policy. I have never had a claim in 4 years and have a good FICO score? I aint gonna argue with em though!

    Yeah they do...I do it.

    I included that as I use two full time road crews out striping for 4-5 months out of the year....I usually lose a guy or two over the winter. Apartment complexs even a big one cost me what $200.00 worth of striping paint and gives me a place to train a few guys on a local easy lot Vs' setting them out on a major national retail stores property with a paint striping machine and nary a clue?? thanks for the advice but I would be doing churches or abandoned lots for free to train these guys anyway. Why not offer it to a paying client?

    I'm in the Springs. I really dont have a clue as to what the other guys around here are charging...I got those prices from reading through some posts on this forum. I took the past two winters off and made ZERO dollars. I like the thought of starting something that can make me money during the "Off Season"? I dunno Maybe I'll raise it up to $100.00 per hour on my other bids......
    Havent bought the blade yet....Been thinking about that V-blade. But yeah I see where you are going with the big blade as I'm in and out....Problem is that I dont know how to bid a property at a flat rate. I need to start off doing some hourly stuff. From there I'm sure I'll have it figured out fairly soon....

    This forum is great help. thank you Gentlemen.:drinkup:
     
  10. Camden

    Camden PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 6,598

    Whoa! This has to be corrected. Do you realize how much salt you can spread in an hour? Tons and Tons - literally! Your other prices aren't high enough for you to recoup the cost of giving this service away.

    $.02
     
  11. ServiceOnSite

    ServiceOnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 935

    i know your in a different part of the country but figure out what money you would want to get paid if you went there to plow it out once then times that number by 20. thats your seasonal price. then just bill out seperate for your salt. as everyone else here has said you have to bill out per ton spread. i get 125 per ton spread. as far as getting a bigger plow or a v plow thats a touchy area. your getting paid hourly. im not saying you have to milk it but you have to make money. if your gonna go out and spend 4-5 grand for a new v plow youll have to work 66 hours just to pay for the plow. as far as restriping and sealing the lot for free. go for it. mabey it will get you a few more jobs from neighbors and they will probally want you back next year. just for the hell of if your going to include that service for them i would just ask the for a ball park number of what they normally spend on plowing a year. most customers will lie a littel bit on the price but it might just get you a clue if you are in fact that lost on the pricing. good luck