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Any ideas on price?

Discussion in 'Bidding & Estimating' started by LCS Inc., Oct 27, 2008.

  1. LCS Inc.

    LCS Inc. Junior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 16

    Spoke with owner today and he informed me that all items located within the RED are to be plowed. Rather then make myself look bad I suggested that I get back with him after mapping and measuring the lot. Any ideas? I won't be near my computer for a couple hours so if I dont repond let me know

    scan0002.jpg
     
  2. LCS Inc.

    LCS Inc. Junior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 16

    K- well I see that maybe more onformation needs to be added- let me know- just rough guesses would be great as well.
     
  3. LoneCowboy

    LoneCowboy PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,760

    That's a big lot
    how about square footage and/or acreage?

    special conditions, always people there or is it empty?

    places to stack the snow? (anywhere, only certain places)

    salt, no salt?

    trigger?

    etc

    details man, details,
     
  4. LCS Inc.

    LCS Inc. Junior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 16

    No salt as of yet- trigger 2". Lot is a trucking company so it will have trailers in the vacinity of places shown sometimes. I'm pretty sure I'm way over my head in this hwever I've got acess to other trucks (i.e. subs). Lot size is very hard to tell. one inch is 280ft. on that scaled down map. I saw the guys last year plowing the lot and they are a reputable company. I'm figuring if I say "you show me the last years invoices/invoice and I'll under bid by 15% I should do alright or am I asking for trouble. My contracts are billed in increments of 1-3, 4-6, 7+inches. I'm really sorry about sounding like a jackass but I'm used to lots a quarter this size. i can usually ball park a small job but this is more then I can truly bid and feel comfortable.
     
  5. Superior L & L

    Superior L & L PlowSite Veteran
    from MI
    Messages: 3,039

    Tell the owner that i'll do it for 20% cheaper than you quoted based on 15% less than he was charged last year. Man I love being "Busy"
     
  6. Superior L & L

    Superior L & L PlowSite Veteran
    from MI
    Messages: 3,039

    I quote somewhere between $500-$5,000.00
     
  7. ford6.9

    ford6.9 Senior Member
    Messages: 452

    So heres a thought I am going to share.

    If your bidding against a reputable company then that means in your eyes there doing good work. Most likely they are going to have a little more equipment than you and maybe even a loader out there. So when your going 15% lower your really going much lower than that, They are most likely 30% more efficient than you. Therefore your price should be at least 15% higher if your going to try to make the same amount they make. And don't forget sales tax, If you don't charge it you'll end up paying it.
     
  8. Superior L & L

    Superior L & L PlowSite Veteran
    from MI
    Messages: 3,039

  9. cet

    cet PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,202

    If 1" equals 280' then I don't think I would tackle that with a pick up truck. I hope they guy that did it last year didn't cut 15% off the previous years price or you are really in trouble. I will never ask what it went for last year but I will ask who did it last year. Some companies I know are really cheap and some are really good, there are none that are really cheap and really good, and I hope to never be. Bid what you need not what someone else needs.
     
  10. cretebaby

    cretebaby PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 4,162

    why would you do it for less than last year

    at least charge them what the other guy charged them last year

    either way who cares how much last year they either did a crappy job or they are just cheap since they are looking for someone new
     
  11. hydro_37

    hydro_37 PlowSite Veteran
    from iowa
    Messages: 3,790

    Hate to say it but if you undercut last years plow co then you are being a "lowballer" just to get an account. JMO
     
  12. Woodland

    Woodland Senior Member
    Messages: 269

    This has to be the quote of the season. Hard to believe this is the "competition".
     
  13. Ipushsnow

    Ipushsnow Senior Member
    Messages: 314

    Just at a glance I would say you need at least two large loaders with big pushers, 2 skid steers, and 2 plow trucks. You got some big, long, wide open areas there and trucks aren't going to be too effective if you get more than an inch or two.

    Yeah, you are way over your head.

    Your comment about looking at last years invoice and pricing it 15% lower makes my head explode. Don't ever, ever run a business, no matter what you do, like that. Take the time to measure it, go out there with a friggin tape measure if you have to, and figure out the time and your costs!!! Then set your price accordingly.

    The amazing thing isn't just that you would price this job based off the last guy's price, but that you would admit it here!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  14. cretebaby

    cretebaby PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 4,162

    i read somwhere that 50% of plowing businesses flop

    so how do you know which half last years guy is give ya one good guess since the same guy isnt doing it this year
     
  15. LCS Inc.

    LCS Inc. Junior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 16

    Wait a second- some of you are going to ridicoule me for under bidding a job huh. isnt that the name of the business. I posted a thread about a week ago about doing drives at $6 per drive in a subdivision and several people said that if fact it could make me money do it. I said HELL NO> You guys are hipocrits. forgive me Im deaf in one ear and can'tr hear out ther other. I'm not ttrying to STEAL business but actaully give the owner a fair comapraison. I said if I can't do15% I wont quate another price. I'm a business person that hates the idea of dojnng business without making money- I WNT DO IT. But, I will make $.75 on the dollar any day if it's profit. No one out herar has been curtious enough to give me a ball park idea. Each and everyone has been stuck on the fact that I underbid the REPUTABLE company. Come on if he has 5 guys working for him and 5 trucks and I have 2 guys and 2 trucjs. I'M GOING TO BE CHEAPER! LESS overhead etc. i have insurance, I have a couple trucks. i'm not a SCAB per se and I like to make money- what the big deal. I'm irrateated that this site is like this!
     
  16. LCS Inc.

    LCS Inc. Junior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 16

    Oh and don't forget- I am waiting to hear from more established companies before I make a quote. I'm not stupid-
     
  17. ford6.9

    ford6.9 Senior Member
    Messages: 452

    If you have two trucks two guys and he has five guys and five trucks his overhead very well could be the same PER TRUCK. Which is all that matters. Insurance rates may be lower per truck do to volume and cost of insurance per account would be less as theres more accounts.

    Theres no way to give you a ballpark price without knowing your equipment? Loader with a 16' pusher vs. truck with 8' blade would be a huge difference. You have to know what your able to get per hour for your trucks and then figure how long it will take you and then thats your answer.

    Where are you stacking the snow?
    How many trucks?
    What size blade?
    experienced drivers?

    Note* Name of the game isn't go cheaper. Name of the game is rise the service quality bar and make everyone want YOUR SERVICE. I have won quite a few bids this year,at prices much much more than what the current companies were doing it for. My reasoning? They weren't charging enough to make it worth their time to provide a quality service. And the managers and owners agreed.

    Not being harsh trying to help you out.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2008
  18. LoneCowboy

    LoneCowboy PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,760

    You should walk away.
    "thank you for the opportunity to bid your property, however at this time our company does not believe we can meet your needs, please try Joe at XYZ plowing who may be better suited to handle your particular needs"

    You clearly aren't sized for it.
    You aren't willing to put any effort into it (how big is it? I'm not measuring the # of inches around it, it's not my job)
    No company would show you someone else's bid, although maybe after the bid has been won, they might.
    A great big job can either make you or break you, in this instance, i think it would put you out of business.

    You should walk away and do lots that you have a competitive advantage at. (and this isn't it)
     
  19. LCS Inc.

    LCS Inc. Junior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 16

    LoneCowboy- I just spoke with the owner about 15 minutes ago- we got an inch last evening. He informed me that rather then a per push basis the other company was charging him $60 per hour per truck at three trucks per push. No I don't have three trucks however I could bid it out at $55 per truck per hour, still make another sub happy at that rate- it is a bad economy as we all know. And give it a shot. I'm not trying to be a low baller but the fact of the matter is this. At the end of the day I need to put food on the table. If the rates which around here are between $50-$65 per hour for a 4x4 need to be tightened so I can have work- then I gotta do what I gotta do. Not to mention- this is a company that I've done lawn care for the last two mows. Myself alone on a Toro Z 60: deck took me 1hr. The other compnay- same doing the snow removal was charging him $85 per mow. I think he's made enough money on this account. It's my turn.
     
  20. LCS Inc.

    LCS Inc. Junior Member
    from Indiana
    Messages: 16

    1274200 sq ft= 29 ACRES- Give or take