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Any help appreciated, electrical noob here

Discussion in 'Western Plows Discussion' started by Pugz, Jan 9, 2016.

  1. Pugz

    Pugz Junior Member
    Messages: 10

    Good evening guys,

    This is my second post ever on plow site so bear with me please.

    To start I have a 2002 f250 7.3l diesel and recently purchased and restored a used Western Pro plow. The plow came with the two relay system. I followed westerns instructions and wired up the plow. I rand the passenger purple to the white/light blue and the driver side brown to brown and grey to green/white (both the brown and green/w are off the back of the turn signal). The previous owner had an extra wire spliced into the brown wire but this is going no where?

    My results have been strange, after checking grounds and grill connections I have running lights on the plow only, the turn signal causes both sides to flash like hazards on both the truck and plow. I have no high beams (replaced relay, same result) and when I trigger the high beam I have only the left plow light lighting up.


    Any help would be appreciated, I have working diagrams and the mechanics manual but have not been able to figure this out. Thanks in advance. Snow possible tomorrow.
     
  2. mishnick

    mishnick 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,243

    Those relay systems are a royal pain in the butt. So many wires and a spaghetti mess of connections. 5 pins on every relay and only two relays.... your lucky, some have 6 relays.

    It is possible to upgrade your plow and truck to a three plug, three port isolation module system. Will cost about $1000 but will be more reliable, it's simple to install (in comparison) and much easier to troubleshoot when there is a problem.

    Other than that it's just a matter of testing every wire and every relay one step at a time.
     
  3. dieselss

    dieselss PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,965

    You taped into the pass side turn signal correct?
     
  4. Pugz

    Pugz Junior Member
    Messages: 10

    My last western had an isolation module, and yes it was a world of difference.
     
  5. Pugz

    Pugz Junior Member
    Messages: 10

    Yes I ran the purple wire to the white/light blue turn signal wire on the passenger side when I did this I experience the symptoms of both lights flashing when using either turn signal I left it disconnected for now, and my running lights are working as they should
     
  6. dieselss

    dieselss PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,965

    Do you have the rectangular headlights with 2 bulbs for the parking and turn?
     
  7. Pugz

    Pugz Junior Member
    Messages: 10

    They are long and rectangular and then on the end of each there's a tall pointy lense, there's a second small ball in the side marker part, but tall pointy part. I tried running the parking lights off of that connector separately and had no difference
     
  8. dieselss

    dieselss PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,965

    Huh? Not sounding like factory western lights.

    My thought is the turn wire is not hooked up right inside the light housing causing a backfeed
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2016
  9. Pugz

    Pugz Junior Member
    Messages: 10


    I thought u meant on truck, sorry. I have The older western sealed beams
     
  10. Pugz

    Pugz Junior Member
    Messages: 10

    Sounds like a good idea, I'll open them up and take a look, I did notice that there is two left sealed beams on the plow, meaning he replaced one and obviously the same side Wasnt available so he used whatever was available. I knew there was a reason I got such a good deal on this plow LOL
     
  11. Pugz

    Pugz Junior Member
    Messages: 10

    Hey dieselss what part of indiana are you in? I'm in Mishawaka near South Bend. Went to Pnc in westville for college.
     
  12. dieselss

    dieselss PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,965

    Nwi. All 38 years

    So if he put a new light on, he might have had to do some wiring, maybe there's your problem
     
  13. Philbilly2

    Philbilly2 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,586

    Where is your can do attitude??? You make me sad today.
     
  14. mishnick

    mishnick 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,243

    I get frustrated with relay systems because they are so hard to help with without laying hands on them. People always seem to say "I am sure I have the right harness, its all hooked up correctly, the relays are fine and it still doesn't work." There are just so many things that can go wrong and they are typically so old that the wires have been replaced with different colors. Sorry for my negativity.....
     
  15. TJS

    TJS PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,339

    One grand is absurd to upgrade to iso stuff just to get lights to function. This is exactly why i build my own harnesses for everything. I built my own harness with switch,two relays and some wire for about 15 bucks. Never had an issue or a failure. Albiet all independent.
     
  16. Randall Ave

    Randall Ave PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,977

    I have an 02 f350. Mine is wired like TJS's. You do not have DRLs so its very easy to do. The relay system on your truck is not very hard to work on if that's what you want. It sounds like they are not wired correctly, or you have bad grounds at the plow lights.
     
  17. mishnick

    mishnick 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,243

    It's not just a matter of money. I agree that nobody wants to spend $1000 but everybody wants their equipment to work. For those who don't have the skill to troubleshoot (or re-engineer) their own equipment but do have the cash it's an option. One great advantage of the old two plug relay system is that the functions all work even if you don't have any relays installed. That being said... it is easy, for someone with basic electrical skills to run their own proprietary switch for the headlights. But consider the loss of resale value when you try to sell a jerry-rigged system. Also consider troubleshooting that system when you break down in the middle of a snowstorm. Then think about the poor guy who has to reverse engineer your work when you aren't around. For a guy with a single plow the "do it yourself" system may be fine but not necessarily for everyone. We owe it to people to lay the options on the table and let them decide. it's always a decision between money and taking the time to "figure it out." And as I read back in this thread no-one has been able to give any concrete direction for Pugz. Perhaps if we knew the bulb typ (ie: H13, HB5 etc) and how many pins (7 or 9) on his grill plug we could actually verify he is using the correct harnesses, number of relays etc...
    Has anyone offered you the link to the electrical schematics? Here it is: http://library.westernplows.com/ddcommon/dd_pdf/pdfs/22373.07_110108_for_web.pdf
    Just look in the index for your system. You will see in the index 3 port iso module, 4 port iso module and relays systems. look in relay systems and you will see 7, 9 and 12 pins. The 12 pin is for MVP so assuming that Pugz has a straight blade (which he still has not verified) it will either be an early 7 pin or a newer 9 pin. All he has to do is go to the correct pin section and then find the page with his type of truck headlight bulbs. From there it depends completely on his mechanical electrical aptitude and skill.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2016
  18. TJS

    TJS PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,339

    So here is another option. Go to Amazon and type in Grote plow headlight. For 82 bucks it comes with new lights and wiring. He has no DRL and this "kit" is what I based mine off of(however I added relays) so my wiring colors match what they should be if anyone were to try and "diagnose" an issue, and my stuff is not jerry rigged. To the OP if you get this do not use scotch locks, shrink tube and solder your trigger wires from your signal lights. Never had a problem.
     
  19. Philbilly2

    Philbilly2 2000 Club Member
    Messages: 2,586

    I hear you. Just bustin your balls. I know EXACTLY how you feel there, I just hate iso modules as they took all the adventure and satisfaction of tracking down the problem and fixing one part $10 part as appose to the hole box... where is the pride and workmanship anymore? :mad:

    I am sure it is just a product getting older...


    Yep, I have had tons of trucks wired that way. I would always just buy what ever lighting harness I could find on ebay for a few dollars, cut all the bullsh*t out, get two new relays and a pair of toggles. My guys always loved the fact that on our unimounts, then first gen ultras (pre nitehawks) that they could drop the plow down a bit and use the truck headlights over the top of the plow when we were headed to plow or back from plowing. I still can't believe how terrible those plow lights were back in the day in comparison to now...
     
  20. Randall Ave

    Randall Ave PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,977

    My vehicles are not jury rigged. I have never installed a used harness on any of my trucks. As far as the relay systems are concerned. They are not that hard to work on. But if you are not used to looking at wiring diagrams, you will get lost. Also by some questions people ask they do not have a basic understanding of how circuits work in vehicles.