1. Welcome to PlowSite. Notice a fresh look and new features? It’s now easier to share photos and videos, find popular topics fast, and enjoy expanded user profiles. If you have any questions, click HELP at the top or bottom of any page, or send an email to help@plowsite.com. We welcome your feedback.

    Dismiss Notice

Another huge Sub contracting problem

Discussion in 'Commercial Snow Removal' started by Jguck25, Nov 21, 2010.

  1. Jguck25

    Jguck25 Senior Member
    Messages: 592

    So I was searching around craigslist just for the heck of it and I came across this listing.. It reminded my of some other threads on here with people talking about how much they pay their sub contractors and plow operators. According to those threads, many people on here pay their employees more to plow in the COMPANYS truck, nevermind in their own trucks. http://nh.craigslist.org/lab/2072294594.html
     
  2. Rc2505

    Rc2505 PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,245

    That right there is a lowballer trying to find someone stupid enough to plow thier work for even less money then they are charging. I wouldn't even fire up a snowblower for 20 dollars an hour let alone a plow truck.
     
  3. TPC Services

    TPC Services Senior Member
    Messages: 875

    I would an I have email clowns like that back an told them that they are a lowballer and that I wouln't pull my truck out for anything less then $55 per hr. Had one guy email back. So I gave him my # to discuess his atttiude and the reason why I called him a lowballer but never got a call. What a Chicken $&^# I'm a nice guy i wouldn't of hit him, not that hard anyway (LOL)
     
  4. Tubby's Snow Plowing

    Tubby's Snow Plowing Senior Member
    Messages: 199

    Well, if someone accepts the position, that would seem they are in agreement that the price paid for the work is reasonable otherwise they wouldn't accept it. It's called free market. The market will dictate the price.

    Why would you harass someone like that? It's childish and unprofessional. Let them go on about their business and you do the same. I don't care one bit what someone else charges or what they pay their employees/subs. I do what's best for me and my business.
     
  5. Jguck25

    Jguck25 Senior Member
    Messages: 592

    I did not harass him, I just simply thought that it was ridiculous that he would be doing that because I would be LOSING money at that price. not even breaking even. And if that guy is paying that amount then that means he is not going to get anyone with insurance or a decent truck/plow. I am simply just pointing out how many people there are out there making it very hard for people who are actually trying to survive off of this money and still pay overhead.
     
  6. DodgerFan

    DodgerFan Senior Member
    Messages: 111

    I don't know what to think of that Ad...speechless actually??? Even without having Ins etc. (don't know about you guys) I'd still be losing money...WTH

    If your that :confused: you need to go work at the local Ding Dong factory...You might even make head Ding Dong maker!
     
  7. Tubby's Snow Plowing

    Tubby's Snow Plowing Senior Member
    Messages: 199

    If someone is happy with the pay, what's the problem?
     
  8. Brian Young

    Brian Young PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,382

    Wow and I thought we lived in the cesspool of plowing wages. Even if you have a truck paid off it still wouldn't be worth it unless the driveways are 20-30 minutes apart. I can have 20 driveways done within a 3 or so mile radius in about an hour. I gave up trying to understand how and why people do what they do. I have 2 guys who were supposed to be my crew leader's this year come up MIA. I talked to one guy today who said "I'll call you in a hour or two and we can meet up for the route sheet". That was at 11am.....:(
     
  9. DodgerFan

    DodgerFan Senior Member
    Messages: 111

    Would you do it? Or want to do it?
     
  10. Jguck25

    Jguck25 Senior Member
    Messages: 592

    Its not really even everywhere thats like that.. I mean yeah, a lot of the pricing is ridiculous around here but i mean the town that i live in will pay you 89.50 a hour if you have a 3/4 or 1 ton truck with a sander and 9 foot plow. This guy is just ridiculous. And im sure that the people are only happy doing it because they have NO idea whats happening. they see 20 bucks and hour and theyre like oh thats not too bad ill do that. I have only sub contracted once and that was just because a local business who i am on good terms with needed me to in a pinch, and i got 65 an hour with just a plow and no sanding.
     
  11. Tubby's Snow Plowing

    Tubby's Snow Plowing Senior Member
    Messages: 199

    I have done it for that and less. The one thing people on here really don't seem to understand is different markets will have different prices, wages, and costs of living. Here in my area, $15-20/hr for a sub with plow truck is a very good living, such that you can just plow in the winter and play all summer without much worry.

    The market will stabilize a price. If this gentleman can't find anyone to do the work for the wage offered, he will have to raise his wage offer or do the work with the crew he has now. I will never tell someone what to pay their crew or their subs. That's up to them and their market to dictate.
     
  12. Jguck25

    Jguck25 Senior Member
    Messages: 592

    I deffinately agree with what you are saying, but around here, that will not fly. He will be plowing for two years to pay for one years worth of insurance.. That just doesnt add up. That person plowing for that money will not be plowing next year. But honestly, when you did it, was it recently or a long time ago? and how much money did you actually make while doing it?
     
  13. creativedesigns

    creativedesigns PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,929

    Tubby, show us pics of ur truck....NOW! :jester:
     
  14. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 640

    You are so full of it it isnt even funny. Have you ever did a little thing like figure out your expenses? 20.00 per hour and that should allow you to take the summers off. LOL:jester:
     
  15. erkoehler

    erkoehler PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,268

    Careful, they get a TON TON TON of snow up where he is. Depending on the truck, etc. it is very possible that he is telling the truth.

    They have stretches of 20+ days where it won't stop snowing!
     
  16. Tubby's Snow Plowing

    Tubby's Snow Plowing Senior Member
    Messages: 199

    It was recently. I just started plowing last year. I worked as a subcontractor last year for several outfits and as a backup for other subs to get experience. Now I added a snow plowing division to my main company and do this in the winter.

    The money details are private, but I was happy making what I made.
     
  17. Italiano67

    Italiano67 Senior Member
    Messages: 640

    I dont care if you work 24-7 for two months straight at 20.00 per. You pencil it out for me and show me after fuel and wear,insurance, etc, how it comes out.Every hour worked comes with expense.
     
  18. Tubby's Snow Plowing

    Tubby's Snow Plowing Senior Member
    Messages: 199

    Before you run your mouth like a fool, I suggest you look at the link in my sig line. I've also been in business for myself (other industries) for over 4 years now. I know a little bit about business management and survival.

    My county averages over 200 inches of snow per year and has done so for the last 10 years.

    I lived in Wisconsin for the first 22 years of my life, 12 of it in Green Bay, so I'm well aware of your measly 70 inches per year. I've lived in the Fox Cities most of my life. I'm also well aware of the cost of living in Green Bay and surrounding areas. $20 per hour in Green Bay, no I wouldn't. Supply/demand economics and cost of living.

    This is what it looked like this morning. This is after getting 3 inches on Monday, about 6 inches on Tuesday, about 5 inches Wednesday, then about 6 inches Thursday, and another 12 inches last night. That's half of what you get all year we got in 5 days. We aren't even done with November yet. Lots more to come.
    [​IMG]
     
  19. erkoehler

    erkoehler PlowSite Veteran
    Messages: 3,268

    DAMN, your making me want to get my sled out :)
     
  20. Tubby's Snow Plowing

    Tubby's Snow Plowing Senior Member
    Messages: 199

    16 hours a day average
    21 days per month plowing
    336 hours per month
    5 month season is 1,680 hours
    $20 per hour
    $33,600 per season in gross pay

    To put that into perspective, that's the average household gross income for my county. The snow plowing figures above are for one person working 5 months of the year to make what two people make on average up here working full time all year.

    After fuel, insurance, and budgeting $1,000 for front end work, you're looking at around $20,000 take home. The most I've heard of a guy spending on repairs in a year was $2,000. Still very doable at $20/hr.