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810 cutting edge wearing uneven.

Discussion in 'Blizzard Plows Discussion' started by SSS Inc., Dec 30, 2013.

  1. SSS Inc.

    SSS Inc. PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 14,376

    I just noticed today on one of our Blizzards that I've got about 1/2" more wear on one side as compared to the other. On the main plow, not talking about the wings. Anyone ever see this and what would be the cause. I have never seen this on our other plows so I'm a little baffled.
     
  2. SnowGuy73

    SnowGuy73 PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 24,868

    I saw this in another post about a blizzard doing the same thing.

    I don't think anyone had any constructive ideas or thoughts on it though.
     
  3. fastjohnny

    fastjohnny Senior Member
    Messages: 654

    Greater amount of time plowing with blade angled to one side vs the other, mount not level side to side, aframe has a twist, etc. Could be any or combination of these things.

    Fix with carbide edge addition in high wear areas.
     
  4. bb1069

    bb1069 Junior Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 12

    dido on the extra cut edge on one side for plow

    You can also take another piece and double up on on side or both. They also make moldboard edge protectors that extend toward center some on moldboard that will also give you more flotation on that side to help with the wear. Are you running shoes on plow and are they adjusted. I am not familiar with this particular plow, but it doesn't really matter. Check you tire pressures all the way around. You could also have some spring sag on that side of truck, causing plow to set down on that side. I ran a large plow crew for a city and we did most of the repairs, fabrication, and training on them for 24 yrs.. Who is operating the unit, and are they checking everything out before operating them. Is the area where you have been plowing got a rise or hump in pavement in areas that could effect wear? Sounds like you need to now some more info, to say the plow has a problem.
     
  5. SSS Inc.

    SSS Inc. PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 14,376

    Thanks for all the responses.


    BB: We have several trucks and this one happens to be mine. Everything gets checked pre storm. Nothing is missing, broken or loose. In this case I would have to say its not the driver.(I hope):)

    FastJohnny: You might be on to something. We have plowed about 8 times so far this season. Two storms ago one of the wings would not extend out. It was more or less frozen(Ice build up and temps have been well below zero for weeks). Anyway, I plowed a good chunk of the night with only one wing out. I can't imagine the extra weight hanging out there was enough to wear it 1/2" but maybe.
     
  6. bb1069

    bb1069 Junior Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 12

    Now that I know that you had one wing out, your right, Fast Johnny might be on to something there. All truck plows have some up and down deflection left and right on the moldboard center pivot or the back pivot mounts so that they can float. Don't know of any that don't. Definitely excess weight on one side would cause plow to settle on that side. Are you tight blading or running shoes. If you are running shoes adjusted properly(at all times), and the A-frame is allowing side to side deflection to both sides, then excessive wear to one side on the bottom of cutting edge should not occur unless the pavement has a slight hump, your running curb areas , or something where you are plowing. Road edges for instance, beside these things, have more sand debri, etc. on the right side which is an abrasive, and if heavy enough more to one side can speed up wear on that side some, to the shoes and the bit even if it is very slightly off the ground, but is can very easily be affected by uneven terrain. Have you done these areas before this year and if so what was the result then and was the pavement condition of these areas the same? It is pretty common to see, for a various amount of reasons, for the trailing edge of a plow to wear slightly more on that side as well as the shoes. Is the bracket that holds the shoe fit the shoe shaft good and not letting it fold back, etc. and let that side settle down more?
    Another thing to consider, is that there is more down force on the trailing edges because they are caring more weight of the snow and naturally force them down and the leading edge, being lighter tends to float up slightly in comparison, especially with light truck plow systems, which is not as bad on a big heavy truck plows that highway systems use on dump trucks, etc. Try a different plow if you can in the same situation and compare the wear of it watching it over different times and condition changes, and compare, if it is that important. Do a study of your own and see what you find. Plow manufacture engineers and field reps. can be very helpful in all of this and can probably give you some answers as well. They have usually have seen it all if they have doing it awhile. Get a phone # and call them. They have usually heard all of the problems. If they can't give you any advice, then call another manufacturer that makes one similar and ask them. Note: another thing that can happen, is if you have a bottom edge, your springs could be weaker on that side, causing the more pressure on trip edge trying to ride down before flipping back, since cutting edge is probably at a 65 degree angle or so. ( don't know how you have yours set or what your mfr's recommended angle is, which is very important)
     
  7. Green Grass

    Green Grass PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 9,571

    Fixed it for you Thumbs Up
     
  8. SSS Inc.

    SSS Inc. PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 14,376

    Hey Green grA$$, don't you have anything better to do. :laughing:
     
  9. Green Grass

    Green Grass PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 9,571

    just posting random places to keep up with snow Thumbs Up
     
  10. SSS Inc.

    SSS Inc. PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 14,376

    Why do you think I posted here?? I don't even own a Blizzard. :laughing: J/k
     
  11. Green Grass

    Green Grass PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 9,571

    I know all you have is snow plow shovels. :rolleyes:
     
  12. viper881

    viper881 Senior Member
    Messages: 457

    Had the same problem on one of them. Everything looked like it was all bolted fine. Ended up looking closer and the side that was wearing down had a bolt on the truck side cracked. Both side were still in the hole but it had some slop. Replaced the bolt and put a shoe on the side that was wearing quicker and it is slowly evening out. I will have to replace the edge from abnormal wear but it is helping it slowly wear back to normal.
     
  13. wizardsr

    wizardsr PlowSite.com Addict
    Messages: 1,551

    One wing out and one in for a storm would not cause a 1/2" difference in wear. I'd be checking for a tweaked a-frame, I've had to have my LP's straightened a few times, the 810 uses the same a-frame. $50 later on a frame rack to pull it back straight and you're good to go.

    Also check the truck-side mount, although that's not as common as tweaking the a-frame on the plow.
     
  14. bb1069

    bb1069 Junior Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 12

    Ok, Fastjohnny has been here before, and sounds like he knows some facts and has some background in this particular plow.
    Since I don't own an 810 and have only seen one of these around here after looking it up and viewing it to know what we are dealing with. I'm pretty sure that FastJohnny will agree with me on the following. The following checks will be easier if you have 2 people.
    1) We'll assume that you had both shoes adjusted correctly, and that you had all washers on top of shoe shafts so that shaft could not slip down and shoe would not get bound, slipped down at times. If normal deflection up and down on both sides is good on plow and shoes setup right, the plow should have approx. same wear across, giving that you had not been working on alot of uneven pavement and that is the bottom line. Even extra weight on one side should not have effected wear much, again if these things were correct, and the shoe brackets are not worn or tweaked, etc.. I noticed that the shoe brackets in the picture look a little weak like most of the light truck plows. The cast steel round base, round post shoes that are common on truck plows, typically are SUPPOSED TO spin so that they wear all around the shoe evenly, but a lot of times this does not happen and if part of the shoe has a excessive wear spot on it, it may get turned and stay on a high or low spot once it forms one typically and will settle into that position at times. Your plow now is setting lower or higher on one side or the other, causing this same problem, though when you set them up, everything looked good.
    2) Shoes were setup correctly?, don't assume. Let's rule out some things. Put truck on flat concrete, plow being perfectly straight forward, and measure to make sure. For most accurate results, normally we would do some checks w/ new bit and shoes, but since yours is worn we'll do it a little different. For accuracy purposes, All Measurements can be done off of other common points of blade and truck on both sides , not using blade bit or shoes for measuring right now. Run thru Up position measurement checks for truck, plow etc.. Compare right and left throughout starting at truck frame , truck plow mount frame, plow A-frame at back and toward front, plow, blade frame tips, etc. You could even take plow off and check truck frame measurements without anything attached to check for sag. A weak or failed spring or shock on the truck could cause some problems, but I really think from the little information that we have, that you may have just had a shoe issue, or uneven pavement issue if nothing is tweaked, but again, a little wear on the trailing side is not uncommon, but a 1/2" seems to be a little strong. Did you notice any difference in how it was scraping up snow on one side verses the other. Make sure that your up and down deflection is pretty close to the same as well. If there is little or no deflection allowed, it could cause excess wear on that side shoe and eventually the bit. Rule these things out. Compare the Blade pivot head on the tip of the A-frame with a torpedo level, versus the A-frame framework. If it very bad, you should be able to visually see it anyway. Later you could check to make sure one of the wing is not bent down on the tip, etc. . The bottom line is if you want to make checks, rule the truck out and start working forward, unless there is something that stands out, which apparently there isn't. The leading end could have been riding a lot on a high point on that shoe, forcing a pivot to the trailing side of the trailing shoe. Don't know, not enough info on all of that, so rule out the truck, plow, etc. It may just be a freak thing because of heavy ice on one side, etc. and nothing is wrong. ???
    When checking, record everything on a chart, if only for future reference for a problem in the future. There are more checks you can make after all this, but I doubt you'll need to.:salute:
     
  15. SSS Inc.

    SSS Inc. PlowSite Fanatic
    Messages: 14,376

    I'm pretty sure you are correct about this being a problem for more than one storm. That seemed like a ton of where to me as well after I thought about it a bit. Pretty sure I just never noticed until the other day. Once I get back out to our shop I will be able to check things out and get a better handle on it. Haven't hit anything but who knows.


    BB: Thanks for all the help. We don't run shoes on any of our plows so that's not the problem. Some of your other hints will be helpful though.Thumbs Up
     
  16. bb1069

    bb1069 Junior Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 12

    To the guys bending your A-frames, sounds like you guys need to beef up the A-frame if bending the A-frame is common or complain to MFR. about it. Sounds like a weak link. Especially if you haven't hit something pretty hard. and that usually bends something else. Maybe they have a heavier newer A-frame avail. now. IS it twisting, rotating on the pin boss tip or are the side channels bending, or tweeking, etc.... ?
    Couldn't find a good clear picture of a 810 A-frame, etc. to look at construction weak links. ..Just curious.
    I grew up with a very skilled German Grandfather and the some of the best racing fabricators and machinists in the business of their era.
    Like to know what you find out on this one when you find it.:)
     
  17. Cooter24

    Cooter24 Senior Member
    from NE Iowa
    Messages: 268

    We are noticing our main edges wearing faster than the wing edges on a few of our older 810s. We believe it is due to running carbide on the wings and the wing pins wore out. This allows the wings to ride up slightly, putting more weight on main edge.
     
  18. bb1069

    bb1069 Junior Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 12

    The pin wear could definitely not help and could cause that over the wing not wearing the same. Just curious, I take it that your not running carbide on the main edge as well.
     
  19. Cooter24

    Cooter24 Senior Member
    from NE Iowa
    Messages: 268

    No carbide on main edge. I believe we will try the carbide on main edge next plow that gets new edges.
     
  20. bb1069

    bb1069 Junior Member
    from Kansas
    Messages: 12

    Curious: Are the pin bosses worn inside or at the top and bottom and are the pins worn too. I wished I had a better picture of how it is built and put together. Do you have room at end of pin boss to get shims in or are you going to have to build it up? Where is the wear at?