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24vdc-12vdc

Discussion in 'Heavy Equipment' started by HD61CUIN, Jan 28, 2002.

  1. HD61CUIN

    HD61CUIN Senior Member
    Messages: 173

    I just decided to add more lights to my front end loader the electrical system is 24vdc, that might explain why the previous owner added a radio and blew it up. So how do I go down 12volts? I priced a transformer from radio shack and it was $120. That seems outrageous, I can get a 120 vac-24vdc 40 amp for around $8 dollars from grainger? I am looking to add some lights and a radio so lights are around 10 amps a set and the radio should be 10 amps right?
     
  2. SCL

    SCL Senior Member
    Messages: 265

    I know that with tractors they make voltage reducers about the size of a quarter that cut from12 to 6 volts, About $10, might try your local equipment dealer or auto parts store,
     
  3. HD61CUIN

    HD61CUIN Senior Member
    Messages: 173

    Yep tried that and found what you were talking about. Just no 24-12, I plan to install the lights tomm wiring in series, hopefully the weather will hold out one more day. I would really love to get a radio though, I ran the loader twice before..it can get quite boring without tunes. I bought a temp boom box, to tide me over until I get this voltage thing straightened out. I have to check grainger in the am and see what they have for stepdown transformers.
     
  4. Garagekeeper

    Garagekeeper Senior Member
    Messages: 459

    J C Whitney has 24 to 12 volt reducers in their catalog. Or go on line at jcwhitney.com and type in 24 volt in the product search.
     
  5. John DiMartino

    John DiMartino PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 2,154

    Doesnt the loader have 2 12 volt batterys? All the ones ive seen just use 2 12 volts in series,you just hook up to one or the other battery,and you got 12 volts.I added some lights,and a rotator light to a loader like this 5 years ago,they still work fine.
     
  6. HD61CUIN

    HD61CUIN Senior Member
    Messages: 173

    Two batteries yes, they are paralled producing the 24v system that is in the loader. I have the lights solved, just need to get something worked out for a cb and radio. I will have to check JCW. For the lights take the 24v in cab and series 2 12v lights together and install a switch...
     
  7. John DiMartino

    John DiMartino PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 2,154

    so you have 2 24 volt batterys?in parallel,correct?. So there is no way to get 12 volts without a reducer.I figured it would have 2 12 volts in series.
     
  8. HD61CUIN

    HD61CUIN Senior Member
    Messages: 173

    Well JC W that should do the trick for 36 dollars. That is a 10 amp capacity, I should be able to run both my radio and CB off that. I don't expect to be drawing more than that. Yeah this 24v is killin' my ideas, I didn't expect to find that when I started to add my radio today. I only got the antenna installed and started looking to run power and boom found 24v. So that ended that project. I have to get that converter so I can finish the radio install, then on to the lights.

    Thanks all
     
  9. SLSNursery

    SLSNursery PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 140

    How about a 24v radio.

    My loader runs on 24v as well. In fact the cigar lighter says 24v right on it. It came with a radio, which I assume is also 24v. Have you tried to find one (I know this is an obvious question, sorry)? Mine is a Samsung, and the radio says Samsung as well, but it looks like one of those typical import Panasonic or Matsushita jobs. Maybe the equipment dealer near you has them even if they are for a different brand.
     
  10. digger242j

    digger242j Senior Member
    Messages: 672

    I didn't see an answer to this question--but I've never seen a 24 volt battery. I've seen lots of 12 volts. My Case 680 has 2 in series to make a 24 volt system, (and incidentally uses 24v lamps for everything) and I run a Cat loader with four 6 volt batteries in series to make 24 volts. My '78 International dump truck has three 12 volts, and they are in parallel.

    Here's a question--when you forget to turn those lights off and run the batteries down, how do you jumpstart the machine, if all you have is your 12 volt pickup truck? (Been there and done that by the way, but I figure if I ask maybe somebody will know a better way and I'll get some education, or maybe in the course of the discussion somebody that hasn't faced the situation yet will get educated, which is why we're all hanging around here anyway...)
     
  11. HD61CUIN

    HD61CUIN Senior Member
    Messages: 173

    Actually no I haven't checked for a 24v radio. I can get just about any car stereo for free. No not stealing, I know a junkyard that gets their cars from the local towing companies. If you dont claim your car then after a matter of a year it can go to the salvage yard. I picked up a ford radio and speakers cheap for my other loader, that has a 12v system though. If the price ain't too bad have to look at that too. Thanks

    No I have no Idea how to jumpstart...please dont die please dont die please dont die
     
  12. fredd357

    fredd357 Junior Member
    Messages: 4

    HD61CUIN, I would think that you have two 12V batteries in series to get 24V. If you wire it up the way John DiMartino mentioned you will be all set. Just to be sure look at the two batteries. The batteries should be wired as follows, plus of bat1 to minus of bat2 and minus of bat1 to plus of bat2 (wired in series or added together 12+12=24).

    Just hook your power wire for your radio to the plus side of the first battery, this way you will only get 12V. I hope this makes sence and helps you. :p


    bat1
    [+ -]
    bat 2
    [- +]

    OR

    bat1
    [+ -]
    bat 2
    [+ -]
     
  13. SLSNursery

    SLSNursery PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 140

    This might help

    The first battery is the one that is grounded to the chassis. As long as you grab that positive you will have half the voltage.

    Digger - To jump start I came up with 2 options.

    1. use 12 volts on first battery (the one that is grounded to the chassis). If it isn't a really dead battery or two, then it will draw twice the amps off of the jump supply battery. So if you have a big source you might be ok.

    2. If you only have 12v, coming from a truck, for instance, set up on the first battery (the one that is grounded to the chassis). Let that one charge up for a while. Then disconnect the supply. Hook up the supply (-) to the positive (+) of the first battery, and the supply (+) to the positive (+) of the second battery. This should allow the first battery to take a surface charge, and supply some amperage from the supply charge to the second battery to lessen the draw.

    3rd. This I just thought of, but it should work - please correct me if I am wrong - Take 2 - 12 volt supply batteries or jumper packs in series - Negative(-) to first battery (-) End positive to second battery Positive (+). This would be like making a big 24v battery to jump from.
     
  14. WHITE=GREEN

    WHITE=GREEN Senior Member
    Messages: 161

    jonh d. is right on. just wire everything direct to ONE battery. i do this on a daily basis with my CAT 953C when fueling up. our fuel tanks have 12V pumps on them, and if i would hook it up to both batteries, pooof, i need a new pump. as long as you only hook to one battery ( pos & neg) you are only getting 12V. just remember with your accessories you will have to turn them off manually since they are not switched.
     
  15. digger242j

    digger242j Senior Member
    Messages: 672

    SLSNursery said:
    That's pretty much the way I've done it in the past. Just use the "jumping" vehicle as a battery charger for one battery at a time on the "jumped" vehicle.

    I've just hooked the jumpers up to the appropriate (+) or (-) poles on whichever battery I was charging. Since the (+) of the first battery is hardwired to the (-) of the second battery I guess it doesn't make a whole lot of difference, but it keeps me from getting confused as easily.

    I would *not* assume that whichever battery terminal is grounded to the chassis is the (-) either. In most cases it will be, but I had a 1964 Case hilift that had (+) as the ground side.

    I'm not sure about that. Would you expect to be able to start your 12v pickup with a 6v battery, even if it were a really big one? I think you need to give a little boost to both batteries. Maybe someone more knowledgeable can say for certain, but I imagine that once you turn the key, and close the circuit, the second battery would be sucking some of your amperage away trying to recharge itself.

    I can see an exception to the above if one of the two is defective. I've had that happen by the way. I could jump the second battery all day long and not make a bit of difference, but if I hooked onto the first battery and cranked the engine it would start right up, but you'd burn your hand taking the cables off. Once I replaced just the first battery I had no more problems.

    As far as option 3 goes, it seems like it would work, but I imagine you'd need to use actual battery cables to connect the two supply batteries. You know how even a loose or dirty terminal will cause you problems.

    HD61CUIN said:

    Yep, that works just as well as, please don't run out of fuel please don't run out of fuel please don't run out of fuel

    :)
     
  16. SLSNursery

    SLSNursery PlowSite.com Veteran
    Messages: 140

    True, I didn't compensate for a positive ground. Sorry.
     
  17. HD61CUIN

    HD61CUIN Senior Member
    Messages: 173

    Well I have (bat 1)(pos+) to starter, (bat1)(neg-) to (bat 2)(pos+), (bat2)(neg-) to veh ground. Two 12v batteries in series sorry, creating 24v not paralled. If I meter pos bat 1 to ground I get 24v, if I meter it to neg bat 1 I get 12v I would have to run a set of wires from pos and neg to get 12v not pos to ground. I have my 12v lights on the veh set up in series off 24v 2 lights 1 switch a total of 10 lights and 2 strobes. 6 front, one each L/R side, 2 rear. I have an IH 515. Actually lost the throttle cable after the storm here the other day...wound up in the 4by4 a total of 23hrs worked plus worked a complete 8 hr day before the 23hr run.
     
  18. jake74

    jake74 Junior Member
    Messages: 1

    I am new to this website, but I think I may have a permanent solution to your problem. Since it is true that most accessories are 12vdc including power points for wireless phones, 2-way radios, arial safety lights, stereo equipment, etc. It may be cost effective to convert your whole truck to 12vdc. It may be expensive at first, but alternators would probably run around $135 for an 80a 12v. Most of the rest would just be changing light bulbs. The starting system can remain 24vdc by utilizing an "SP" (series parallel) switch. This switch is activated by the same starting line that activates the bendix on your starter. This keeps you high torque 24v starter for cold weather and allows for relatively inexpensive accessories.
     
  19. long0

    long0 Senior Member
    Messages: 247

    This is how I keep everything straight. My dozer has a 24volt setup. When it is extremely cold out, I have to jump start it everytime. The best solution I have come up with is to attach a truck to Bat-1 (+ to + / - to -), and if available, a battery charger to Bat-2 (+ to + / - to -). Starts every time. Do not get your positive & negative mixed up when doing this :nono:

    About 7 years ago, my father did that and it sent him airborn from the mixup of cables. Not only did he get hurt, but one battery blew up, and all the wiring between the batteries were fried.

    Just a friendly word of warning.
    Long0
     
  20. KentuckyPlow

    KentuckyPlow Member
    Messages: 64

    It's not a truck, it's a loader